Leona Change: Please I beg you!?

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Incomitatus

Senior Member

04-18-2013

When you have Junglers like Malphite, Amumu, Vi, Hecarim, Xin Zhao, Jarvan who can all turret dive with ease, lock down a target long enough, while still doing massive damage, for themselves or the teammate to get a kill...I fail to see how making Leona a competent jungler would make her overpowered. She would simply be at the same tier as all these other junglers who can just as easily, and more quickly farm, and still rush lane to lane and gank far more quickly and efficiently than she would if she was able to proc her passive even if at reduced damage for herself only.


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CashanDraven

Senior Member

04-18-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keitterman View Post
I think you have just proved that you're a shortsighted person.

This game is actually pretty balanced for the number of champs in it. There isn't anyone out there wrecking the place, and there aren't any champs where the entire game is up-hill for them. Considering the 100+ champs, that's quite a feat.

On to you though, just because you don't know how to make Leona a dominating tank, or the scariest thing in the jungle, doesn't mean it isn't possible. It just means you don't know how to do it. last night I did three more game as Leona Jungle. Check my match history for how those went.

I'm gonna have to go with a no on this one. Also, saying there is no one out there right now that isn't just wrecking the place is just plain wrong. Katarina is still out there blowing people away with minimal effort. This game is far from balanced on any map other that Summoner's Rift, and even that is tenuous at best.

Temmo rules 3 of the 4 current games modes, and is still strong on the last. (Howling Abyss, Crystal scar, Twisted Treeline, and normals respectively)

And I know how Leona works, I've sunk around 100 games into her, and just because YOU did well doesn't mean that it is good or strong in anyway. Right now, in this meta of HP stacking, her passive means absolutely nothing. And just because the junglers in those games didn't counter you so bad you could barely afford pots, you think you were doing well.

Facts, her damage is negligible at all stages of the game, period. Her cc, while long lasting, can ALL be mitigated with items or masteries. And when she dives, she has zero incentive to stay in the fight and do anything, because she can't do anything else for 4 seconds.

Every other tank/initiator can deal some damage or has some reason to stay in tthe fight, hell, that is why they just buffed Sejuani to be like she is, because, and it's not an exact quote but, " We want her to have enough damage to be a threat". Leona does not have this, she can be completely ignored while your team is picked off. She has to 1v5 to initiate and more often than not everyone just dives into the other team because she isn't scary enough to worry about the carry she just latched onto, because hey..the enemy team's carry is wide open.


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Crowcide

Senior Member

04-18-2013

ttt


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Keitterman

Senior Member

04-18-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tankajin View Post
Would not work in ranked at all. her jungle clear times are terrible, her ganks are monstrous. but you need to reach level 3-4 as fast as possible before you can make that happen, and Leona happens to be a slow walking tank. By that time the enemy jungler will have ganked twice before you get to ANY lane.

Also, normal games.
This is incorrect.
why? because you don't need to clear the whole jungle to gank.
If a jungle-built Leona gets a smiteless blue, goes straight to red and kills it (and it will die fast to smite + aa->Q->AA, she can easily kill middle lane, or if top/bot has been overly aggressive, grab them. then, grab a creep camp and kill another lane. Her ganks aren't just powerful, they are amazing. In ranked or not.

Leona's jungle ganks are so impressive that her clear time becomes a non-issue, and upon her first trip back with a kill or two under her belt, doesn't matter anyway because you're gonna build most of an spirit stone: Elder Lizard, and clear camps like no one's business.


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Last Elixir

Senior Member

04-18-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
Discussed this and we're not likely to add this.

Leona's pretty balanced right now, but her jungle would likely push her into an unbalnaced state. The reaction to that would be to remove current power (Rank 1 CC's or other core functionality) that would ultimately damage the character. Not worth the cost/benefit ratio to allow her to be more a solo character.
Thank god she would be terrifying.

The coolest implementation of something like this I could think of though would be enabling Leona to proc her own passive when she dealt true damage to something, which while it sounds cool could turn her into a hilariously beastly solo laner.


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Last Elixir

Senior Member

04-18-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaolla View Post
<points at xin> so morello is saying we should make xin support only
Xin who can go to any solo lane or the jungle and be fine?


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CashanDraven

Senior Member

04-18-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keitterman View Post
This is incorrect.
why? because you don't need to clear the whole jungle to gank.
If a jungle-built Leona gets a smiteless blue, goes straight to red and kills it (and it will die fast to smite + aa->Q->AA, she can easily kill middle lane, or if top/bot has been overly aggressive, grab them. then, grab a creep camp and kill another lane. Her ganks aren't just powerful, they are amazing. In ranked or not.

Leona's jungle ganks are so impressive that her clear time becomes a non-issue, and upon her first trip back with a kill or two under her belt, doesn't matter anyway because you're gonna build most of an spirit stone: Elder Lizard, and clear camps like no one's business.
Clear times ALWAYS matter, no matter who you are as a jungler. If you're denied farm you will fall behind. And an underfed Leona is going to just get beat to hell and back without all of those big ticket items she needs to actually do her job.

She has good ganks, ok fine, but you know what, a ward will completely destroy that, end of story,more so than others simply because she is slow and her kit far less forgiving on a miss or even a miss-click.

Her clear times are terribad, and unless your team is going to watch your jungle, be prepared to lose almost all of it, especially your buffs to a competent jungler, and god forbid you have to dual the other jungler, Kazix, and Diana both will just obliterate you into nothing right off the bat, and Nasus and Shyvana simply are too tanky for you to do anything to.

Face it, the numbers simply don't add up when you actual factor in the other team, like you keep forgetting to do. You're not the only one who is decent at the game like you seem to be implying. Because if I had games were people just let a Leona run around in the jungle, or anywhere for that matter, I would laugh my head off.


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CashanDraven

Senior Member

04-18-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Last Elixir View Post
Xin who can go to any solo lane or the jungle and be fine?
It believe you missed the sarcasm in his post my friend.


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Keitterman

Senior Member

04-18-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by CashanDraven View Post
I'm gonna have to go with a no on this one. Also, saying there is no one out there right now that isn't just wrecking the place is just plain wrong. Katarina is still out there blowing people away with minimal effort. This game is far from balanced on any map other that Summoner's Rift, and even that is tenuous at best.

Temmo rules 3 of the 4 current games modes, and is still strong on the last. (Howling Abyss, Crystal scar, Twisted Treeline, and normals respectively)

And I know how Leona works, I've sunk around 100 games into her, and just because YOU did well doesn't mean that it is good or strong in anyway. Right now, in this meta of HP stacking, her passive means absolutely nothing. And just because the junglers in those games didn't counter you so bad you could barely afford pots, you think you were doing well.

Facts, her damage is negligible at all stages of the game, period. Her cc, while long lasting, can ALL be mitigated with items or masteries. And when she dives, she has zero incentive to stay in the fight and do anything, because she can't do anything else for 4 seconds.

Every other tank/initiator can deal some damage or has some reason to stay in tthe fight, hell, that is why they just buffed Sejuani to be like she is, because, and it's not an exact quote but, " We want her to have enough damage to be a threat". Leona does not have this, she can be completely ignored while your team is picked off. She has to 1v5 to initiate and more often than not everyone just dives into the other team because she isn't scary enough to worry about the carry she just latched onto, because hey..the enemy team's carry is wide open.
I should really stop responding because you think Kat is in any way unbalanced, but here I go...

Teemo on non-SR maps in countered with an item that has an AD and an AP variant. if you don't buy it, that's on you.

Leona can be built for damage, but you don't do it, probably because you don't understand the game mechanics of how. She has horrible AP scaling, so don't build AP. There's lots of guides, I've advertised mine on Champ feedback a lot, you can look it up if you want. Most of my recent games I spent more time in their jungle than mine, as I ward theirs and keep them down, else Rammus or Nasus will snowball my team. I don't like that happening, so I make it a point to stop them.

Leona can be quite the force to be reckoned with from a damage output + cc stand point, because you haven't figured out how does not mean it isn't being done. Don't be so close minded, you may learn something.


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ARGorilla

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Senior Member

04-18-2013

how about making it trigger on only neutral monsters, i dont understand the issue there, if its ganking, support bot can just take tele and do the same thing.