bans for reports

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DonVadim

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Senior Member

08-23-2012

Im curious why does Riot care so much about false reports while they keep saying that tribunal is working as intended and noone ever was/will get falsely suspended. It is hard to belive there is actual logic behind recent actions


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Blarghel

Member

08-23-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonVadim View Post
Im curious why does Riot care so much about false reports while they keep saying that tribunal is working as intended and noone ever was/will get falsely suspended. It is hard to belive there is actual logic behind recent actions
What has this got to do with if the Tribunal is working? If people try to abuse a system then ofc you punish them for it even if they failed with their abuse?


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TotalDisorder

Recruiter

08-23-2012

No, actually he's right. The point of the tribunal is prevent "false reports" from going through. There are already mechanics in place to deal with people who report often and who don't do it to punished people.

They change their reporting value to O(bad idea since these people probably still vote down a lot of accurate people).

Riot doesn't want to increase the value of doing the tribunal (IP Reward) to handle the masses of tribunal cases, so they are doing this as a way to eliminate a large number of reports so the tribunal can catch up.


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Yuan Shikai

Senior Member

08-23-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by TotalDisorder View Post
No, actually he's right. The point of the tribunal is prevent "false reports" from going through. There are already mechanics in place to deal with people who report often and who don't do it to punished people.
Tribunal is there to prevent false reports from being punished, does not mean Riot should just look away when people TRY to abuse it and INTENTIONALLY do false reports.

They already stated, Tribunal is ONE system to keep toxic players at bay, does not mean they are not legitimately allowed to use others too.


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TotalDisorder

Recruiter

08-23-2012

If they do INTENTIONAL false reports, sure, ban them. But some of these people haven't.

By all means use all the systems, but you also should tell people if they're doing something wrong, before punishing them. A week ban for "over reporting" is not in balance and is onsensical when compared to a verbal warning for racist insults. The false reporting can be corrected by tribunal. Being a racist jerk is instantly ruining someone's day.


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DonVadim

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Senior Member

08-23-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blarghel View Post
What has this got to do with if the Tribunal is working? If people try to abuse a system then ofc you punish them for it even if they failed with their abuse?
Nono you don't understand. Tribunal is meant to bring JUSTICE - ban people that other's experience. Riot stated hundreds of times that tribunal is working perfectly fine and is doing great job. Therefore "false" reports are NOT a factor for tribunal. However, recent actions create two possibilities:

1. Tribunal is working as intended so recent suspension made absolutely no sense. They only enraged people that got banned and created terror amongst everyone that report other players. Nothing good will come from this as enraged players are most likely to stop spending money on this game while feared average players will stop reporting people so "toxic" players will not be punished by tribunal. Its hard to belive Riot would strike themselves for absolutely no reason though.

2. Tribunal system is suspending almost everyone no matter what, so false reports actually ARE a factor and are ruining the system, leading thousands of unjustified suspensions. That would actually make a sense why Riot decided to bring attention to false reports and punish them. However this version would be in conflict with what riot is saying about efficacy of tribunal so nothing good would come in this case aswell - it would only prove Riot lied about tribunal all the time.


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DiscoJoker

Senior Member

08-23-2012

I know riot has multiple systems for determining conduct. Tribunal is only one of them. I think that the Tribunal isn't designed to punish people for over reporting and they didn't want to make it that way. Especially since a human's discretion is needed when deciding to punish someone for over-reporting


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IS16e7c68f67142a

Senior Member

08-23-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by TotalDisorder View Post
If they do INTENTIONAL false reports, sure, ban them. But some of these people haven't.

By all means use all the systems, but you also should tell people if they're doing something wrong, before punishing them. A week ban for "over reporting" is not in balance and is onsensical when compared to a verbal warning for racist insults. The false reporting can be corrected by tribunal. Being a racist jerk is instantly ruining someone's day.
It has nothing to do with over reporting, it's about false reports. People who report and the person has done nothing wrong. This fact has been stated over and over so at this point you have to just be oblivious to it all.

This is the worst .2 percent of people that falsely report AND are toxic players.


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IS16e7c68f67142a

Senior Member

08-23-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonVadim View Post
Nono you don't understand. Tribunal is meant to bring JUSTICE - ban people that other's experience. Riot stated hundreds of times that tribunal is working perfectly fine and is doing great job. Therefore "false" reports are NOT a factor for tribunal. However, recent actions create two possibilities:

1. Tribunal is working as intended so recent suspension made absolutely no sense. They only enraged people that got banned and created terror amongst everyone that report other players. Nothing good will come from this as enraged players are most likely to stop spending money on this game while feared average players will stop reporting people so "toxic" players will not be punished by tribunal. Its hard to belive Riot would strike themselves for absolutely no reason though.

2. Tribunal system is suspending almost everyone no matter what, so false reports actually ARE a factor and are ruining the system, leading thousands of unjustified suspensions. That would actually make a sense why Riot decided to bring attention to false reports and punish them. However this version would be in conflict with what riot is saying about efficacy of tribunal so nothing good would come in this case aswell - it would only prove Riot lied about tribunal all the time.
You say that recent suspensions made no sense even though these guys' weight in the system was null, but you fail to see any of the points they've made already. These are people that do much more than just report, they abuse the fact that they can report to be toxic players in game, threatening everyone with reports and then trying to get innocent people banned (even though their reports don't mean anything to the tribunal, he doesn't know this nor does the people he threatens.)


It's about punishing people that are toxic, not about some sense of justice for causing unexpected bans.


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TotalDisorder

Recruiter

08-23-2012

Incorrect. The "toxic players" is done by the tribunal. If they were toxic, they'd already be punished by the tribunal. Many were not.

The "worst .2%" are a number that an algorithym chose. It is based on number of reports filed vs number of reports punished if number of reports > x.

Guess what? That means if you say someone was racist, and the majority of people voting in tribunal vote pardon, even if they say the N-word openly, it counts as a "false report".

Riot itself has said that they would be much more strict most of the time in the tribunal than the players are.

See the disconnect here?


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