Need help against katrina as Anivia.

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Wolf Un1t

Senior Member

08-10-2011

Even though I play anivia a lot one of the only people that give me trouble solo lane is kat. Mainly because she has the ability to teleport and evade every single combo no matter how good I lead my Q. As well as teleport out of my R instantly. She can get close real fast which scares the **** out of casters. Then press R. Ok now thats the main problem... her R. A lot of my teammates say for me to stun her before she kills us all. the problem is, in team fights, she teleports to a complete unexpected place to use R. I have to pull out Q, aim at kass since she teleported to who knew it was gonna be there, and then fire a very slow moving Q before she kills us all (and that is when an annoying trynd or singed isn't charging at me). Gee sounds easy. Seems to me all I can do is buy MR no?

I was also called a noob which made me a little sad, because I'm level 30 and been playing this game for a while. But if we don't make mistakes we never learn anything no? So that is why I'm asking this.

Anyone can give me anditional tips that be great thanks in advance


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pyromencer

Member

08-11-2011

ok, so not to be mean, but i main katarina. and one of the hardest people to mid vs is aniv.

so, now that i got the mean part outta the way let me tell you whatcha need to do.

1. watch what the first skill she gets is, if it is her bouncing blades becareful, always have 2 minions between you and her target untill she starts leveling it(which should be her priority till level 6. your stun is going to be your key, you say she cant be hit, but that is only becuase you are being either too passive, or predictable. remember she can only shunpo to either friendly or hostile enimies, and unless she is going for an outright kill she WILL NOT shunpo onto you. this means watching the minion line and forcing her off of it. once that is done, you have more burst then her. from there zone her. dont auto attack however tempting it might be to farm, just last hit. if you have been playing aniv for as long as you said you should know how to kill enimies with one hit. this will keep her from getting any exp or gold, you jsut out farm/level her to win, if she rushes in stun/ice spike her(i dont know the name of anivs skills jsut know in that order will most likly take 25-50% of her life) and she will run.

2. remember she has long CD so if you see her use one skill wait 1-2 seconds, then aproach. she will be hesitaint to commit to a fight and you can either push her off the lane or deal serious damage. her auto attacks are as weak as yours. so if she cant hit you with her skills, she will run. force a miss, there is nothng you can do about shunpo if she is commited, but you can out range her bouncing blades. just wait for her to shunpo, stun and run icelance as you retreat and you got your combo while she only got 1/2 of hers

3. dont let her farm. she is highly relient on her items, her skills scale well with items, so the base damage on her skills is fairly low. yours should be roughly double the damage making you a scary force in the start, but once she can start wittleing you down your ****ed, hit her hard and fast, be relentless. her only advantage over you is that she does nto require mana, which means if she can outlast you she can win. DONT LET HER. if you commit to casting a spell, make sure it hits.

4. your ulti is useless vs her. yes it is damage, but the amount of mana it costs to use it wont be worth it. if you plan on useing an alty make sure she is stunned inside of it, or her shunpo is on CD otherwise she will just shunpo out.

5. her ulti, there is nothing you can do to stop it, yes you can stun her, but that is it. if you can tell where she is going to go to ulti be prepaired, otherwise jsut run away, it has a short range, and it is usually more proactive to flash out of it vs trying to stun. but this also depends on the cercumstances.


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Cerubois

Senior Member

08-11-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by pyromencer View Post
4. your ulti is useless vs her. yes it is damage, but the amount of mana it costs to use it wont be worth it. if you plan on useing an alty make sure she is stunned inside of it, or her shunpo is on CD otherwise she will just shunpo out.
Generally sound advice, aside from this part. You mentioned you haven't played Aniv much, so I'll explain. Early-mid game, Anivia uses her ult simply to get the double damage off of frostbite (icicle). That's pretty much it. If the Anivia is quicker than Kat, then the icicle will hit her, regardless of Kat flashing out of it. I've also forced several Katarinas to cancel their ult early simply by throwing my ult down. They see their health dropping, and are worried about that stun that's slowly flying towards them. Saves me, and sometimes nets me a kill.


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Wolf Un1t

Senior Member

08-11-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by pyromencer View Post
ok, so not to be mean, but i main katarina. and one of the hardest people to mid vs is aniv.

so, now that i got the mean part outta the way let me tell you whatcha need to do.

1. watch what the first skill she gets is, if it is her bouncing blades becareful, always have 2 minions between you and her target untill she starts leveling it(which should be her priority till level 6. your stun is going to be your key, you say she cant be hit, but that is only becuase you are being either too passive, or predictable. remember she can only shunpo to either friendly or hostile enimies, and unless she is going for an outright kill she WILL NOT shunpo onto you. this means watching the minion line and forcing her off of it. once that is done, you have more burst then her. from there zone her. dont auto attack however tempting it might be to farm, just last hit. if you have been playing aniv for as long as you said you should know how to kill enimies with one hit. this will keep her from getting any exp or gold, you jsut out farm/level her to win, if she rushes in stun/ice spike her(i dont know the name of anivs skills jsut know in that order will most likly take 25-50% of her life) and she will run.

2. remember she has long CD so if you see her use one skill wait 1-2 seconds, then aproach. she will be hesitaint to commit to a fight and you can either push her off the lane or deal serious damage. her auto attacks are as weak as yours. so if she cant hit you with her skills, she will run. force a miss, there is nothng you can do about shunpo if she is commited, but you can out range her bouncing blades. just wait for her to shunpo, stun and run icelance as you retreat and you got your combo while she only got 1/2 of hers

3. dont let her farm. she is highly relient on her items, her skills scale well with items, so the base damage on her skills is fairly low. yours should be roughly double the damage making you a scary force in the start, but once she can start wittleing you down your ****ed,

4. your ulti is useless vs her. yes it is damage, but the amount of mana it costs to use it wont be worth it. if you plan on useing an alty make sure she is stunned inside of it, or her shunpo is on CD otherwise she will just shunpo out.

5. her ulti, there is nothing you can do to stop it, yes you can stun her, but that is it. if you can tell where she is going to go to ulti be prepaired, otherwise jsut run away, it has a short range, and it is usually more proactive to flash out of it vs trying to stun. but this also depends on the cercumstances.
You make a few good points, but you also point out that she has long cooldowns, well... so does flash frost, and quite a long one. Most aware enemies WILL dodge it, especially since kat has shunpo to make it all easier. I'm smart and have three months of experaince as anivia, I know that Anivia has ridiculously high mana costs, and if I'm out of mana, there isn't really match I could do since I cant save myself from ganks or get my combos off to scare her away from constant harass. And when I b, I'm letting her farm... which you said is key to shut her down.

The kat I played against was very very experianced, 2k + wins in normal. The problem is I'm not being predictable/passive, she saw my agressive stance toward her, and my flash frost was heading straight for her, which she did not expect, but she can just easily teleport to one of her minions, no matter how slow her reflexes were, and heck why not throw a blade why she was at it. After one time I decided to wait until she shunpo before I can attempt to combo her, but she never shumpo until she went in for a kill or to dodge my flash frost. Did I mention her shumpo had a shorter CD than flash frost with no cost?

She leveled up her blade a lot, so I was constatnly being harassed even when the whole minion wave was in front of me. Since Anivia is squishy, she can't take much of that.

You give a lot of advice in laning, but not much after she gets her ult. You also say the best way to avoid her ult before it kills me is flash out of it. Her ult has a 60 sec cooldown. Flash has a much longer cooldown.

"hit her hard and fast, be relentless. her only advantage over you is that she does nto require mana, which means if she can outlast you she can win. DONT LET HER. if you commit to casting a spell, make sure it hits." I am a very comitted Anivia player, wanting to get better as Anivia. I read Hypershatters guide three times. Hypershatter also mentions a very crucial point that I strongly agree with. "A common pitfal of Anivia players is that they are too agressive in lane" -Hypershatter. Once that mana pool drops to zero, kat is laughing.

Hypershatter mentions a point about "passive-agressive play" Going all out when the time is right, and playing passive whenever you arn't. Honestly this works against most enemies I lane against, as katrina is the only champ I've ever lost a mid-lane to. Zoning her out is agressive play no? By constantly threatning with my burst I am lowering my gaurd down (not to mention my mana pool if she gets in too close for a combo, what if the kat bought some MR, then what?) and raising hers, making me sesceptable to ganks, when I get ganked guess what happens, she farms. Eventually she will get her ult and proceed to do massive damage, possibly killing me, before I can stun her. As you said before items make her dangerous, so if I play passive I am obviously less likely to get killed, but I am letting her farm. It seems like a lose-lose situation.

She shunpos only when she knows when she can kill me or dodge a tricky flash frost. Let's say she dodges a flash frost using shunpo. This is not a good situation for me, she uses her shunpo on me once she notices I used my flash frost and ults the **** outta me. I'm not gonna sit there and let my squishy champ take tons of damage while my combo doesn't ourburst her ult. Her level 1 ult with no cost outdamages my whole combo, and that's if she doesn't shampo, with no items.

Oh yes my egg, I have an egg and sitting on the tower, so if she wants to kill me she will have to die. So she tries it, she kills my weak egg and I get a kill from the tower. Perfect right? Wrong. As you said she scales with items, she can buy those items and get back to the lane quicker because anivia has slow MS, not to mention the minions were pushed to my tower, so great my tower is taking heavy damage, I'm losing the mid-lane. She can quite easily push to my tower with the bouncing blade (no cost woo!), and if I want to push I'm draining my sweet mana which you said I should be using to threaten her.

Anyone wanna give me help there


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Alucard628

Senior Member

08-11-2011

anyone with an offensive blink really gives me trouble with anivia is aswell, i dont see why any kat would have a problem facing anivia. the second you throw the iceball(still dont know the name even tho i play anivia a lot lol) she shunpos over it at you then opens up on you while you throw a non combo flashfrost or whatever. good gps are also a pain because they just get out of the stun/debuff right away so i can't combo.


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Wolf Un1t

Senior Member

08-11-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alucard628 View Post
anyone with an offensive blink really gives me trouble with anivia is aswell, i dont see why any kat would have a problem facing anivia. the second you throw the iceball(still dont know the name even tho i play anivia a lot lol) she shunpos over it at you then opens up on you while you throw a non combo flashfrost or whatever. good gps are also a pain because they just get out of the stun/debuff right away so i can't combo.
and even if you are able to combo her, her ult alone still outbursts you. Thats why I wait using Flash frost, but how can I be agressive without it? So lets say i be agressive using my ult and FB which has short short range. Getting close to an assasin is a baaaaaad idea, and on top of that in drains your mana! how wonderful!

I feel your pain bro... I guess the thing I learned from this game is play passive and build some MR.