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The true evolution

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Jasiwel

Senior Member

06-23-2014

Quote:
Kratospie:
So with pretty much everything else Solcrushed was working on being done, why hasn't he responded to this thread?

He was probably moved to a different champion, probably the relaunch team, which is fine in all honesty. On top of that, Riot has inferred several times already they aren't close to touching Viktor, despite how much feedback we give. Basically, it'd have to be a rework on their side because no one in the office really even plays him enough.

So yeah, they don't trust us to give the missing feedback they'd need to improve our champion.

Because making his Q the same range as his AA would make him OP. Or decreasing his Death Ray's mana cost by 10 mana each level. Or giving him +10 MS because he has to be in near melee range to be effective. Or even FIXING THE LASER BUG THAT HE'S HAD FOR AT LEAST 6 MONTHS NOW.


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The Anagram King

Senior Member

06-23-2014

Quote:
Jasiwel:
So yeah, they don't trust us to give the missing feedback they'd need to improve our champion.

Because making his Q the same range as his AA would make him OP. Or decreasing his Death Ray's mana cost by 10 mana each level. Or giving him +10 MS because he has to be in near melee range to be effective. Or even FIXING THE LASER BUG THAT HE'S HAD FOR AT LEAST 6 MONTHS NOW.


It's disgusting, right? He's such an easy champion to fix. He's ALREADY VIABLE. But he's so littered with clunky, buggy, awkwardness that it negatively impacts upon his presence in game.

Yes, he could use a rework of some kind down the line maybe - kind've like Sejuani got (minor tweaks to bring her in line with the current game flow), but there's an obvious list of minor issues that could be easily and safely addressed that only seem daunting because each and every one of them is *blatantly ignored*.

No player-dev interaction, either. So lame.


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BattlecastPeanut

Member

06-26-2014

420 pages and 2 years of nothingness..

Solcrushed ''THE EVOLUTION IS NOT-REAL(LY-SOON)(TM)''


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Kratospie

Junior Member

06-29-2014

Quote:
Jasiwel:
He was probably moved to a different champion, probably the relaunch team, which is fine in all honesty. On top of that, Riot has inferred several times already they aren't close to touching Viktor, despite how much feedback we give. Basically, it'd have to be a rework on their side because no one in the office really even plays him enough.


It's not so much that he's moved on that is upsetting, rather it's the lack of any communication from Solcrushed about why he shelved working on it and moved onto other projects without so much as a notice in this megathread.

However, at the very least the rest of Riot has mentioned the possibility of changes:

Two posts from Meddler about Viktor, the first stating he is "a potential candidate for some gameplay tweaks (passive included), rather than a full on rework" and that it would be along the lines of number tweaking and non-art impacting passive changes.

The second one is a response to concerns about just a numbers tweak, taking about issues such as the Hex Core using an item slot and falling off late game along with the fact Augment: Death pretty much outshines all the other Augments. Meddler responds by saying that there are no specific changes nailed down, and that number adjustments could include things such as higher stats on the Hex Core for late game and a faster return speed on the shield from Power Transfer.

He makes no promises about the changes, but does say that the scale of these changes would fall within the scope of this rework.

Along with these two posts from Meddler, IronStylus said that he is on the board for some sort of visual work, but IronStylus said he did not hear anything about him being on the priority list for this year or next year, but also added that could change.

IronStylus said that he would like to tweak Viktor's design, at the very least just a texture update but nothing major.
  • First Meddler Post: http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=48123641#post48123641
  • Second Meddler Post: http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=48123993#post48123993
  • IronStylus Post: http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=48122209#post48122209

So hopefully unlike Solcrushed's work, these potential changes won't vanish without a trace.


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Marace5

Recruiter

06-29-2014

Page 420 HUEHUEHUE


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Toge

Senior Member

06-29-2014

I don't love or hate Viktor. He is a super strong support and a solid laner, but I don't think he can outplay some of the more heavy poke oriented champs like Ziggs. His strength lies in his bubble basically. He can disengage with it as well as have hard engage. I think he's a strong pick, but simply isn't popular when taking into consideration how much safer it is to play someone with an OP escape like Fizz or a safe farm distance like Ziggs.

His extra item needs to be his trinket and it needs to actually work similar to Rengar's trinket.


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King of Bavaria

Senior Member

06-29-2014

Just move his core to trinket plz. I mean that's something you could do.


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Toge

Senior Member

06-29-2014

Quote:
Maximum Viktor:
I don't have this issue since I smartcast everything.


This was something I didn't mention in my previous post, but I DO have this issue and I smartcast everything except rumble's ult because that thing is awkward.


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SquirtsMacintosh

Junior Member

07-11-2014

I have been playing Viktor for the entirety of Season 4. He is my favorite champion because it really does take skill to get good with him but it feels like his power cap is pretty high. Along with most of the people here, I maintain the opinion that his augment is really the only change he needs. The Death Augment blows away the other two, and Power Augment is by far the worst. The passive change to his abilities just don't do what I believe they intended them for. Or, are even counteractive to what the skill is for.

For example, W is meant to be a counter engagement tool, so why the increased range with Gravity Augment? To me that promotes using it offensively, even though that is clearly not what W is for and a poorly placed offensive W can have terrible consequences as now the enemy team can freely engage.

For Power Augment, the stats don't really help him all that much even though it is designed (I feel like) to be the option for a tanky build. The movespeed increase is *fun* but relatively useless in my experience, as it is still hard to peel most champions. Additionally, he doesn't really have low cooldowns so running around enemies doesn't do a whole lot of good. If his ult is not up, he doesn't have very good sustained damage, so I feel like the Power Augment should focus on sustained tanky dps. Instead it makes him a tanky mage with inferior burst (because you don't have Death Augment).

Here are my ideas for changes to his augment. The actual numbers are *that* important, its the idea behind it that I'm trying to get across.

Death Augment
Intended Role: Long Range Hyper Carry Mage

Change:
Shift some of the flat Ability Power you receive into Ability Power per Level. Ultimately give it more power by the end of the game. Currently, you get 3 AP per level and then 45 AP when you buy it and 30% damage on Death Ray for only 1,000 gold. Instead, the core now has 5 AP per level and 25 flat AP. This will reach the same AP as the current Augment by level 10 (75 AP). By level 18 it has an additional 16 AP than the current augment. The 30% damage DoT remains unchanged.

Reasoning:
In my opinion, currently there is no reason to not immediately rush Death Augment over all other items, which feels rather limiting. I do this even before getting any mana regen (other than doran ring) because I can full clear back minions with E. My power jump feels too strong once I get my augment, usually around level 5 or 6, sometimes 4 if I'm playing really good. This change helps keep his locked item slot viable into late game. At level 18, it would have 115 AP and a 30% increase on E. That is comparable to end game items like Deathcap.

-----

Power Augment
Intended Role: Close Range Tanky DPS Mage

Change:
This is a complete rework. First lets talk about the stats. Remove both the flat health and the health regen. Add flat armor and magic resist. How much would need to be tested. Let's say 15 each. Add 1 health regen/5sec per level (18 and level 18). Add % total health bonus (again, not sure on amount). Lets say 10%. Moving on to the affected ability. Remove the movespeed active buff. Slightly increase the shield time on Q (from 3 to 4?). While the shield is active, basic attack decrease the cooldown of Q by a small amount (.5 seconds per hit?).

Reasoning:
Okay, so that was a lot of change. As I mentioned earlier in this post, the movespeed was fun but not very useful - and definitely does not help Viktor fill the Power Augment's intended role. And again we have moved stats to scale over time. Remember the reason is that the core currently feels too weak as part of a full build. It also fits Viktor's motif of glorious evolution and growing stronger as the match progresses. The % health gives players real motivation for building tanky, as it helps far more the more health you get. The active on Q is the really important change, however. It helps him fill the role of Close Range Tanky DPS. Q is short range, and now gives Viktor an incentive to be in the fray (AA range). It allows for aggressive play to be rewarded with shorter Q cooldowns. Lastly, these changes represent "Power," where the current one really doesn't read "Power."

-----

Gravity Augment
Intended Role: Medium Damage Utility Mage

Change:
As far as stats, I think its pretty close. However, since this augment is supposed to make him a viable support, and he only has 1 utility (W), his support viability relies mainly on poking with his Q and E. This requires a good amount of mana. So I suggest we remove the flat 5 mana regen and add 1 mana regen per level. This is a small buff and maintains our evolution motif. Remove the 30% cast range on W. Instead, the Gravity Augment increases % slow on the Gravity Field. The number on this could be tweaked, but let's say a flat 25%.


Reasoning:
The main problem with this augment is in its active. W is meant to be a counter engagement tool, and it is extremely effective in that. But the range increase only promotes using it offensively when it isn't all that effective to use it offensively. The slow increase makes it more reliable CC, which means now you can try to use it offensively more effectively. And it makes it better at what it already does. At max level W with Gravity Augment, the cage would now slow 69% (up from 44%). With more reliable CC, Viktor turns into a more viable support.


In summation, I feel these changes bring the augments up to date and allow for viable build paths into multiple roles, in addition to making Viktor feel like he is growing stronger as the game progresses (glorious evolution). Remember that the numbers could be tweaked, they are just guess by me. My point is that the fundamental mechanic of each augment needs to reflect the role that you have chosen to build towards.


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Desmond Law

Senior Member

07-21-2014

I keep seeing people suggest to turn Viktor's passive into a Trinket, but they fail to realize that the only reason it worked for Rengar was because he had one item to buy compared to Viktor's 3.

Riot could do Rengar's change because they could tack on the trinkets to the bonetooth and still only have 3 trinkets (combined with bonetooth). Rengar just had his one item that could have 3 versions to allow for trinket usage.

However, Viktor has 3 items, which multiplied with 3 trinkets means riot will have to code in 9 different items if they wish to allow viktor to use trinkets with his passive. If they decide to not do the merge, Viktor will once again be handicapped and be missing one item slot, this time, the trinket.