Talon Buffs

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Thane Soren

Recruiter

07-26-2012

Passive - Now works with all of his abilities, activated items if target is under CC. Still including basic attacks

Cutthroat - Targeted scrubn00b is silenced for an additional .25 seconds per rank, starting at rank 2. (Rank 5 would have 2 sec silence)

My reasons:

1. He has no passive. Seriously. If you autoattack as Talon outside the laning phase you're doing something horribly wrong 90% of the time.


End reason 1

___________

2. If you ever played Talon, you'd understand that his silence feels quite a bit underwhelming and is quite lackluster especially for an assassin. He has a damage amp that lasts for 3 seconds. In the absolute optimal conditions you can assassinate a target within those 3 seconds. But the scrubn00b has two (or more, counting in human error on your part) seconds to:

Flash.

Heal.

Exhaust you.

Use any built-in abilities to escape, heal, etc. (I agree it would not be balanced if they could not do this. The problem is they can do it way too fast with such a short silence)

Or even DURING that moment of silence, eat oranges and just be K.

And if you really don't like his silence getting buffed (only per rank, even) then still - it's the last ability an everyday Talon would max anyways.

You also still have one last second to flash or heal or do whatever before Talon can make full and utter use of his 3 second percent damage buff.

(Skip until the line if you don't want to read the rest, this part isn't necessary)

It also adds an entirely new dimension to Talon - how to use your combo.

Since Rake slows the enemy, applying CC to them, you can choose to use it immediately after teleporting to them. Then smack them with your Q with your double damage amplifications, and ult if you want to.

This is the maximum risk combo, with maximum reward.

However, if he is buffed in this manner, there's yet another way to use his combo:

Teleport to the scrubn00b, Q FIRST, and then you can run away and hit them with your Rake while retreating.

This is much lower risk since you're less in their face, but lower reward since you don't get to utilize your passive CC damage amplification.

Or you can Q Twitch, revealing him even if he stealths, allowing you to then poof to him, then Rake (also keep in mind the second pulse of Rake does the 10% increase in damage because the first pulse slows) and ult if you would like to do that.

Your total damage suffers a little, but you can be assured that Twitch really isn't gonna get away from your damage.

This gives playing Talon more thought, more dimensions. Increase his skill cap, while doing absolutely nothing to people who play him incorrectly because they're going to be dead regardless.


End reason 2

___________



Yes, no, maybe?


EDIT: Maybe buff - allow Cutthroat to make him poof to an allied scrubn00b, like Jax and Katarina. Why do you guys think Jayce can't do this? He already has too many escapes. All Talon has is a stealth and speed boost which are both useless if you happen to be caught in a snare blindly shot by Zyra, a Nunu ult, etc etc. Jayce is also tanky, which is another reason why his gap closer should not be able to target allies. His speed boosts are perfect.


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Ryan Firecrotch

Senior Member

07-26-2012

No. Talon is a perfectly fine champion for solo queue and normal games. The reason he isn't competitive is that skilled players know how to counter him with a strong front line that can peel for AD Carries, along with an oracles on those forstated tanks. If Talon tries to kill say, an Ashe in a competitive game, he'll get 6 seconds of CC from a Nautilus and die quickly.

TL;DR The last thing he needs is more damage.


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BuzzJack

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Member

07-26-2012

It is kind of odd that his silence doesn't scale.


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GG4eva

Senior Member

07-26-2012

He's fine, just has a bad spot in the meta.
Honestly though, he'll win 8/10 matchups against most AP mids.


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Thane Soren

Recruiter

07-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan Firecrotch View Post
The reason he isn't competitive.
Is because he has no passive.

As for the rest of your post, you're doing something horrible if you're trying to pwn a scrubn00b Ashe when she has Nautilus guarding her.

These buffs only apply to good Talons,





because bad ones are dead anyways.


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Old Pink

Senior Member

07-26-2012

Passive yes, seems out of place but imho they should just revert the cd on ultimate nerf.


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Ryan Firecrotch

Senior Member

07-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by GG4eva View Post
He's fine, just has a bad spot in the meta.
Honestly though, he'll win 8/10 matchups against most AP mids.
He only loses to bruisers like Irelia or Sion. As long as you pick him after they pick a squishy meta mage like Twisted Fate or Cassiopeia you can ensure you'll be demolishing them in lane.


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Zorasama

Senior Member

07-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan Firecrotch View Post
TL;DR The last thing he needs is more damage.
...but the point of this thread is to buff his damage?

just not in the direct way

and I agree with silence buff but not that much

maybe 1.5

if you're good enough you can burst them in 1.5 sec, but not 1 sec.


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Ryan Firecrotch

Senior Member

07-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reynfall View Post
Is because he has no passive.
As for the rest of your post, you're doing something horrible if you're trying to pwn a scrubn00b Ashe when she has Nautilus guarding her.
These buffs only apply to good Talons,
because bad ones are dead anyways.
Sweet jesus you're retarded.


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Thane Soren

Recruiter

07-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zorasama View Post
...but the point of this thread is to buff his damage?

just not in the direct way
Yeah


I'm not asking for buffs on his base numbers or scalings or anything like that, just his passive to be useful. And even then, they still need to be under CC.

It also adds an entirely new dimension to Talon - how to use your combo.

Since Rake slows the enemy, applying CC to them, you can choose to use it immediately after teleporting to them. Then smack them with your Q with your double damage amplifications, and ult if you want to.

This is the maximum risk combo, with maximum reward.

However, if he is buffed in this manner, there's yet another way to use his combo:

Teleport to the scrubn00b, Q FIRST, and then you can run away and hit them with your Rake while retreating.

This is much lower risk since you're less in their face, but lower reward since you don't get to utilize your passive CC damage amplification.

Or you can Q Twitch, revealing him even if he stealths, allowing you to then poof to him, then Rake (also keep in mind the second pulse of Rake does the 10% increase in damage because the first pulse slows) and ult if you would like to do that.

Your total damage suffers a little, but you can be assured that Twitch really isn't gonna get away from your damage.

This gives playing Talon more thought, more dimensions. Increase his skill cap, while doing absolutely nothing to people who play him incorrectly because they're going to be dead regardless.