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Darius OP??? prove it?

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Carnack

Senior Member

07-30-2012

Quote:
txtmsg:
WHAT THE FAK!? lower CD than no ult CD?


Best case scenario it has no CD. With Leblanc there is not But involved. She has no hoops to jump through.


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CerealBoxOfDoom

Senior Member

07-30-2012

Quote:
Rhadeonyc:
OK i hav read some serius ****** post, like the one that says hes not OP just dont let him get to you because u will be dead... oh the best part when he says, find ur closest AD or AP carry to wipe him down, so ur telling me that if im melee range i need to hav and AD or AP range to killl him, that dosnt sound OP at all


He will kill your ad melee champ probably if you just try a straightforward trade. But if you disengage and recover from the last trade in anyway you can outresource him which is why irelia's grip on the top lane remains unchallenged by darius


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CerealBoxOfDoom

Senior Member

07-30-2012

Quote:
cuchullain:
The problem is, this is still the case.

You are right that he has huge flaws that can be used pretty easily to shut him down, but he is still too good at doing huge damage at close range. He is more than just "anit-melee,"
correct, he his a melee killing specialist. Teams are often made of specialists of various sorts. Like assassins and supports and the like. They all have their specialities. Pantheon, in theory, leaps in and joins the fight fast. Sona heals and shields changing her tune when its time to attack potentially providing her team with a total of 150 armor and mr. If you wish to outshine someone in their speciality it may take some sacrifice or a good matchup.

Quote:
cuchullain:
he can build tanky and still kill almost any champ that gets close to him at 3/4 health in 2-3 seconds
ask yourself. Why does he build so tanky when clearly he needs to prioritize a means of catching people. Perhaps its not so easy.
Quote:
cuchullain:
for most of the game. Avoiding melee range at all costs is a pretty serious condition to place on a team during teamfights, especially other melee champs who are supposed to be good at that.
ironically, melee champs that specialize in melee combat tend to have a way to defeat darius. Those who are not designed for it, are not equipped to defeat darius. Note that I differentiate between combat and winning exchanges. You don't have to win exchanges against darius. Or rather darius tends to lose exchanges that leave his area of expertise. Irelia will take a chunk out of him let him get some hits, then stun and walk away to heal while he tries to keep pace with her superior farming and lane push abilities for example.

As for team fights, you either kill him or you don't depending on your team comp. If you can kill the allies that will keep them in the fight he must either retreat or stay and die. Simple as that. So how to do this without getting close???

The tanks answer is self sacrifice. If he's willing to die focusing a tank then so be it. Or you could just slow him down and make it hard for him to attack teammates who are after the rest of the enemies.
The assassins answer is to patiently seek out an opening and harrass the target using him as a shield if possible. You can't get close to darius so target those close to him. Remember that darius too must try to keep his team safe if possible. Or he risks getting outfed and destroyed.

The carries response is best described by picturing miss fortune and her precision and grace while ulting the enemy team.

Most if not all support units severely outrange darius. And have good poking or CC abilities.

Mages have all sorts of answers but most likely they'll cc him or nuke his whole team.

Off-tanks are strong because they are versatile but lack much speciality. Like darius himself. If he protects, attack what he protects, if he attacks, gang up on him or attack what he isn't protecting.

Take a very careful look at all your favorite champions and see what their true speciality is. I completely misunderstood ahri (my first champ) during the first 200-300 or so games I played as her. I assumed mobile mage assassin just meant she was a fast moving magical assassin. Luckily I did some research after learning she was actually very slow.

Quote:
cuchullain:
This may not make him a strong choice for serious play, but it certainly makes him a pain in the ass, and likely to drain fun from the game for other players. This is especially true at mid and lower ELO, and among players who are, god forbid, not even level 30.
the ones who want to learn will learn as long as there's a thread for it. XD

Quote:
cuchullain:

Basically, Riot released a champ designed to killsteal pentas against teams that make the mistake of getting close to him at less than full life, while still being almost as tough as a tank. Darius asks the low-mid player, "do you want to win every time someone is dumb enough to fight you?" He is the ultimate pubstomper. Do you remember Twitch when the game was first released? It was a similar situation.
twitch was never an issue for me. And I was playing ahri. A perfect target for him and nice n squishy. We lost the match after he got fed but I learned how to play against him before the atch ever even ended. Same with darius.

Quote:
cuchullain:
In most cases, the game should be balanced for competitive play. But, if Riot is going to release champions like this, for whatever reason (*cough* money *cough cough*), then they will have no choice to nerf them down from ridiculous pubstomping status (after everyone has bought them).
I just think of him as another less viable, high speed (gameplay not mobility) nasus.


Quote:
cuchullain:
And, I'm not that good a player, so I guess imad.
let the butthurt flow through you. Embrace the growth the results! Or just don't give up on the idea that darius is perfectly balanced just yet lol.

Quote:
cuchullain:
P.S. I think you know you're not going to get that video, because if a team played perfectly against Darius, he would clearly not be getting a pentakill, or probably doing much at all. The best example of flawless play showing Darius being too strong might just be the enemy team being forced to avoid him, and getting killed by Darius' teammates. I doubt there's a video of that.

I should learn to record maybe. I played a game with a darius on each team. I was volibear. Both were getting fed early. The difference being that my team has someone who was prepared. Me.

He would occasionally catch someone and I would wait for him to start his combo, toss him away and slow him and run.
When this wasn't possible I'd just do what I could to distract him and sacrifice myself for the team carry. He has no evasion and must deal with every single engagement thrust upon him. Chasing carries was not an option and volibear specializes in surviving battles and peeling champs off other champs. Darius got his kill and our carries got stronger and stronger whereas they may have just been weakened feeders otherwise. Unlike darius, voli builds directly into his speciality and guess what, I got boots and a warmog and was set for most of the game, while the enemy darius kept getting goldstarved because his team couldn't win teamfights. He had to just keep building and building while I fed my teammates who could most easily counter him. Our darius continued to grow because not only did he get kills I went with him, being a tank and all, to go farm an empty lane and backdoor their turrets sacrificing myself to any new tricks they came up with so the others could keep feeding. I took our ashe with me as well. When it came time to teamfight again, nothing changed. If a good target came too close I'd rush out and toss him closer to my team and avoid darius. If darius chased and lethimself get isolated I'd sacrifice myself, being a tank, and use my ult to zone out anybody avoiding extra damage. Meanwhile my team either saved me from darius or killed off the ones darius couldn't protect whilst focusing a tank, which he can't avoid on his own. If his team dies he is isolated, the end.

The point being that volibear, not even considered a soft counter to darius, countered darius's role on his team with his own in blind pick. We won the game with a yi feeding them 13 kills. I also fed them 13 times but I actually did my job, being a tank and all. I literally countered darius by forcing him to kill me. That is how deep the strategy of this game can go, and this wasn't even a high level match.


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TheCajungreg

Senior Member

07-30-2012

Lulu would like to have a word with Darius and that word is "Fluffy!"


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CerealBoxOfDoom

Senior Member

07-30-2012

So far the only support that can't seem to handle darius is karma. And I imagine she has a way as well.


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Zaurok

Senior Member

07-30-2012

Quote:
CerealBoxOfDoom:
So far the only support that can't seem to handle darius is karma. And I imagine she has a way as well.


Isn't her beam longer range than his pull? If it's not, she can always mantra shield herself after the pull then beam and run away while landing her other AoE in his face. Not sure if mantra heals are strong enough to sustain his damage.


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Evolnemesis

Senior Member

07-30-2012

All this Darius QQ reminds me of the crapstorm people used to make about Garen.


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CerealBoxOfDoom

Senior Member

07-30-2012

Quote:
Zaurok:
Isn't her beam longer range than his pull? If it's not, she can always mantra shield herself after the pull then beam and run away while landing her other AoE in his face. Not sure if mantra heals are strong enough to sustain his damage.


No clue, but remember that sometimes one champ is a bad match for another. Sometimes you just need a way to escape darius on short notice. No need to smack him. Teemo can do this after lasthitting a minion. The only thing he really needs against darius. Not that he can't just poke him to death


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Rot Panda

Member

07-30-2012

Lets see, Darius has a stacking bleed that scales off Bonus Attack Damage at a .3 ratio that does 12-36 magic damage per stack over 5 seconds, so with no Bonus Attack Damage he can do 60 damage with 5 stacks plus the 5 auto-attacks of 70+ damage each a nice 400 damage that is mixed between physical and magical making you need both armor and some MR to be effective against him.

Theres the q that does an extra 50% damage if the target is on the outer rim of it making it do 105damage + 1.05 bonus Attack Damage.

Theres the Passive armor pen he gets from his E, and Don't forget the ult that can hit for over 350 true damage at rank 1.

Then again this is from someone who mains Rumble and notices that Darius can out damage me easily a low levels making an lane dominance ideas of mine moot.


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CerealBoxOfDoom

Senior Member

07-30-2012

Quote:
Rot Panda:
Lets see, Darius has a stacking bleed that scales off Bonus Attack Damage at a .3 ratio that does 12-36 magic damage per stack over 5 seconds, so with no Bonus Attack Damage he can do 60 damage with 5 stacks plus the 5 auto-attacks of 70+ damage each a nice 400 damage that is mixed between physical and magical making you need both armor and some MR to be effective against him.

Theres the q that does an extra 50% damage if the target is on the outer rim of it making it do 105damage + 1.05 bonus Attack Damage.

Theres the Passive armor pen he gets from his E, and Don't forget the ult that can hit for over 350 true damage at rank 1.

Then again this is from someone who mains Rumble and notices that Darius can out damage me easily a low levels making an lane dominance ideas of mine moot.


Lol, at least it wasn't irelia.