RIOT PLZ. Orianna "buff" is more of a nerf (MATH ITT)

First Riot Post
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DarkerNectron

Senior Member

07-12-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flipsy View Post
To start off, you don't see how her ability to be a utility mage has changed at all? To me personally, a utility mage does sustained damage over time while keeping the enemy close, weaker, and susceptible to further harm. Making her a burst mage means she's blasting out as much DPS in a short time as possible, then waiting for cooldowns to come back before attacking again. Utility mage and burst damage DPS mages are 2 separate spectrums, yet you just stated she can be both, which is contradictory. She used to be able to secure kills for others, and feed her teammates in the case they were around. She does burst damage within 1 spell now, reducing burst damage possibilities in other skillsets, and forcing players new and old to now believe that she needs to be played solely as an AP carry and secure all kills for herself, making this into a single-player fragfest instead of a team game. Her increase of W but decrease of Q is incentive for players to now max W to do damage, because "damage wins games" is what I hear among lower level *******. Increasing AA damage and E range is incentivizing counter-intuitive play but making players think it's okay to be a puppetmaster from miles away, but also to build towards her passive and be up close and personal. This patch is lowering her skillcap and inviting morons to think they have an opinion because she's another burst mage like LB or Ahri.

GCD got counteracted by the speed of The Ball. The Ball's entire purpose was to make the enemy afraid to be near The Ball. At times, you'd see The Ball flying at you and dodge it, or else getting hit by Q would cause considerable damage. Sometimes I wouldn't even hit W after my Q, even if it would connect. I would leave The Ball in their minion wave and if they ever got near it, I would W then to remind them I'm still a threat. Now The Ball is a joke, Q is negligible damage, and W is an 8-9 second cooldown and is her ONLY source of damage. GCD is great for people with the reaction time of sloths and required a nuke to be a successful Orianna. Before, Q was a considerable threat, now W is her only real source of damage. Now Command: Splash (dat Magikarp) is a joke, and the only way to make use of the GCD is to Q and keep The Ball out, which is your means of free armor and MR, meaning you're now squishy again, causing you to (again) falsely believe it's better to autoattack up close and act like a DPS mage against a burster...like Annie.

You want to tell me it was planned for awhile now? Let's see the changes done to Orianna so far:

-W AP ratio reduced to .5 from .6, movement speed/slow boost reduced by 5% at all ranks to 20/25/30/35/40 (nerf)
-W base damage reduced by 0/5/10/15/20 (nerf)
-E shield strength AP ratio reduced to .4 from .6 (nerf)
-AA range reduced by 50 (nerf)
-Q mana cost increased by 10 at every rank to 50/55/60/65/70 (nerf)
-Q range reduced by 100 (nerf)

People complained at this point cuz she was nerfed into oblivion. Riot's response?

-Q mana cost reduced to 50 at all ranks (buff)
-Base mana regen increased by 3.5/5s (buff)
-Mana regen per level increased by .05/5s (buff)
-Q range increased by 25 (buff, but only 1/4 of what was taken away)
-AA range increased by 25 (buff, half of what was taken away, still well within range of everyone else in the game)

And people were AMAZINGLY FINE WITH THAT. Sure, they gave back a fraction of what they stole, but people were okay with it. Riot wasn't planning this for a while, players were fed up with every champion coming out doing AP mid better than Orianna because they had more damage, more escapability, more survivability, more viability in non-aoe-team-comps, and better skill effects. In return, Riot gave some stuff back to keep her up with the current champs and the newer ones coming out so people would still use her. Her skillcap was still high as she was still a utility mage and not a burster, so that kept the unskilled out, but reeled in the slightly curious ones such as myself.

These changes turn her into an entirely differently played champion. The Q at all ranks was actually helpful in making her Q MORE viable, and maxing Q in certain situations made life a ****load easier on players against some of the newer champions. Mana cost was flattened because players were complaining that DPM wasn't worth it with the increasing mana costs, but you're too retarded to catch onto that, you being one of the new Orianna players, huh? 2 Ranks in Q before this patch AND the flattened mana cost patch (V1.0.0.138) was more than enough damage, and was worth the cooldown and mana cost.

GCD wasn't a big buff, nor was it REALLY needed unless their intention was to lower her skillcap so newer players would pick her up and she'd be played more often. However, that removed her viability because now people are playing her solely as a burst mage, and not as a utility mage like she used to be.
I love reading your posts Flipsy, always clearly articulated and well informed.


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Flipsy

Senior Member

07-12-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkerNectron View Post
I love reading your posts Flipsy, always clearly articulated and well informed.
Why thank you


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Chortlebrah

Senior Member

07-12-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flipsy View Post
Holy ****, learn to read more than 5 sentences before falling asleep. Good luck with your SAT's with that kind of a response.

You seen my thread? Don't read it if you don't like lots of paragraphs full of accurate reasoning and dislike towards this last patch that at LEAST 146 Orianna players agree with.

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=2330697
Sorry, i just like to keep my opinions clear and concise without calling people names or saying their opinions are wrong. I simply say I do not agree, and I still... do not agree.


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Flipsy

Senior Member

07-12-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chortlebrah View Post
Sorry, i just like to keep my opinions clear and concise without calling people names or saying their opinions are wrong. I simply say I do not agree, and I still... do not agree.
I call stupid people names when they appear to be as such. I call them like I see them. Was this patch a nerf? In a majority of ways, yes. Are you an intellectually-inept moron who has done nothing but respond back with generic replies that lack any thought, reasoning, or useful information in your response of disagreeance? Yes.

Oh by the way, I had no insults in that big post you quoted and said "holy **** TLDR jesus". Thought I'd point that out while emphasizing the paragraph above this one.


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Flipsy

Senior Member

07-12-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chortlebrah View Post
It's not smart to lvl W first even though it does more dmg. At lvl 5 2 points in Q, 2 points in W, 1 point in E and you should see some nice dmg for a reasonable mana cost.

Ulting w/o W is not smart and would not be recommended in any situation except to peel when extremely necessary.

Also baiting their flash comes in handy. Knowing that your opponent no longer can escape ensures a kill for a smart Ori player.
To further my conquest of making you a laughingstock of Orianna players everywhere, you made this post as if this wasn't already blatantly obvious. BEFORE this patch, a very viable starting skillset for almost any skill path was QEQWWR. From then on, it was player's discretion what was maxed first, Q or W. Players usually DIDN'T ult without using W, unless they were new to the champion. Kind of like how players in lower summoner levels would use ignite on an enemy champion who was at full HP (had this happen when I was playing Vlad at lower levels ALOT). The post you quoted in this one was most likely referencing the high mana cost of a Rank 5 W before level 11, which after 3 Q/W combos, could render Orianna useless and deserving of either death, or a trip back to her fountain. On top of that, everyone and their mother knows baiting Flash came in handy, even before this patch. It's like...you're stating "5 is less than 6" and expecting people to go "woah, that guy, he's so smart!"

This patch has brought out a very interesting group of players to the forums: the ones who love stating the obvious like it's new. Your post I quoted is 1 instance, another instance is something that troubled me even more. Before this patch, people asked how to play Orianna as a nuker, and when players said E the initiator, R/W, and play ping-pong with The Ball from far away so you don't get touched, they got downvoted (myself included). Now AFTER this patch, people are saying the same **** as before and getting upvoted, like this logic is something new. League community never ceases to amaze me.


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PanRouge

Senior Member

07-12-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chortlebrah View Post
It's not smart to lvl W first even though it does more dmg. At lvl 5 2 points in Q, 2 points in W, 1 point in E and you should see some nice dmg for a reasonable mana cost.

Ulting w/o W is not smart and would not be recommended in any situation except to peel when extremely necessary.

Also baiting their flash comes in handy. Knowing that your opponent no longer can escape ensures a kill for a smart Ori player.
Ulting without W is not smart, but it's necessary when your tank NEEDS to get into the middle of the fray. Before, you could W to speed up your tank, R when the tank is in the middle of everyone, Q to do damage to the stunned, E your tank again to keep him somewhat alive, and W to keep people from escaping. It was a combo made in heaven. Notice how much damage I just did using just three spells: RQW. That is a burst mage. It also did several other things. It sped up your tank. It shielded your tank. It stunned your opponent. It slowed your opponent. Your tank has a good shot at surviving this encounter and coming out alive after your next shield. That is a utility mage.

Now if you don't speed up your tank, rather than catching the entire team in your ult, you're more likely to get 3/5 of them. You then cast W to slow those three down while your tank gets focused by the two out side... er... all five of the enemy. You shield your tank E because damage is coming in fast. You then cast Q on one of the enemies, and the battle is pretty much over.

Your damage consists of two spells RW. That is a poor burst mage. It also does several things. You slowed 3/5 of your opponents which got displaced by your ult. You shielded your tank (who is now most likely dead) which means when your E and W come off of cool down, they're being cast on yourself to get the hell out of there. That is a poor utility mage.


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Maeleene

Senior Member

07-12-2012

No Live Team in here yet? Hm.

At least Morello hasn't forgotten us! I'm super pleased with him right now. All my respect! Just take it!


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Chortlebrah

Senior Member

07-12-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flipsy View Post
I call stupid people names when they appear to be as such. I call them like I see them. Was this patch a nerf? In a majority of ways, yes. Are you an intellectually-inept moron who has done nothing but respond back with generic replies that lack any thought, reasoning, or useful information in your response of disagreeance? Yes.

Oh by the way, I had no insults in that big post you quoted and said "holy **** TLDR jesus". Thought I'd point that out while emphasizing the paragraph above this one.
Your tone is very condescending. I would rather avoid debates with people like that. I really don't like to mention numbers because how the champion feels and plays tend to be more important that some numbers that are situational. IMO of course. The end. I disagree with your stance on this issue, that is all.


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Lancell

Junior Member

07-12-2012

After playing approximately 50 Orianna games since the patch I can say with certainty this was a nice buff. She is MUCH more responsive (GCD changes) and the W and E buffs are very nice. The ability to move the ball around more far outweighs the small damage nerf, and the W damage increase outshines the extra damage Q used to put out in team fights. The only negative is the stun removal on R, but her overall RW nuke combo does a significant amount more AOE damage, so it's not completely awful. I suggest everyone be thankful for her improvements instead of dwelling on the small nerfs.


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Chortlebrah

Senior Member

07-12-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancell View Post
After playing approximately 50 Orianna games since the patch I can say with certainty this was a nice buff. She is MUCH more responsive (GCD changes) and the W and E buffs are very nice. The ability to move the ball around more far outweighs the small damage nerf, and the W damage increase outshines the extra damage Q used to put out in team fights. The only negative is the stun removal on R, but her overall RW nuke combo does a significant amount more AOE damage, so it's not completely awful. I suggest everyone be thankful for her improvements instead of dwelling on the small nerfs.
Sorry bud, that opinion is not an option on this thread apparently.