Wouldnt Darius be balanced...

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Hardbuttpounding

Senior Member

06-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xilano View Post
Keep the refresh, make the ult physical with a little bonus ArPen, and everyone's happy (ish)
I don't think he needs the nerf buuuut...

Keep the refresh, nerf the bonus damage from Hemo stacks. I know a lot of people see someone at 700 and swing, but if you make that ~500, I wouldn't feel as cheated.


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Bloodpaly

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Senior Member

06-07-2012

I think darius would be stronger than garen even if his ulti didn't have the refresh mechanic lolol


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EzraTwitch

Senior Member

06-07-2012

Originally Posted by EzraTwitch
Darius, is really really bad since that minor nerf (He wasn't that amazing before). If you are getting rolled by him, please learn the game and stop crying. The Nerf you suggest would make him go from low tier xin tier.

Response

Quote:
Could you perhaps elaborate as to why he is really bad? He has good ratios, a deceptively long poke, a pull that grabs everything in its path, a melee slow that deals bonus damage, an ultimate that deals true damage that refreshes on kill, and a passive that is a scaling dot that deals magic damage while making Darius faster.

I'm fairly new to the game, but to me that seems like a very impressive kit.

Originally Posted by EzraTwitch

He is a melee AD with no defense steroid and no innate sustain. On top of that, most of his damage comes from his abilities, not his aa's meaning do to his abysmal attack speed you barely even benefit form life steal, and you have no AP scaling on any ability which means buying spell vamp is a huge waste.

Additionally though his laning phase is strong, he is extremely (if not the most vulnerable) to ganks which can completely shut him down rather easily, as well as feeding both the jungler and top.

If you build damage, you melt instantly at the start of every fight.
If you build tanky, you have 1 solid damage ability (Your ult) that you have to land perfectly or you become warmogs Garen. (completely ignorable).

As for his "High Scaling"
Maximum = 3.65 off Bonus AD. 1/2 of which is AoE

Riven
Maximum = 5.4 off Bonus AD all of which is AoE, Additionally she has both a Defence Steroid and an Escape Mechanism.

Pantheon
Maximum =5.7 off Bonus AD, 3/4 of which is AoE Additionally he has a near global ultimate, and a defence steroid.

Garen
Maximum=5.3 off Bonus AD 1/2 of Which is AoE, Has CC reduction, Defence Steroid, Escape Mechanism (Additionally since I am only factoring Scaling, he still has a huge ult.)

Every single other AD Caster I can think of has, Higher Scaling, Safer Laning Phase, and More Utility.

The only thing Darius had going for him was his ult reset, which since the nerf seldom happens, (or if it does happens its on someone who would have died anyway during a gank).

He is a pub stomper just like a Xin Zhao, able to dominate unskilled players, and nerfed because of it. He went from barely viable in high level competitive play, to unviable in competitive play with the recent nerf. If you nerf him more, he will go from un-viable in Competitive play to Xin, Eve, Tier (If he's not there already).

Also,
Could you perhaps elaborate as to why she is really bad? She has good ratios, a long range stealth with a ridiculous slow, a huge nuke that shreds armor and mr, AoE Spam that lets her constantly proc sheen/triforce/Lichbane, an ultimate that gives a crazy attack and move speed steroid, along with refreshing whenever somebody dies and healing her, and a passive that lets her kill people in the middle of their creep wave.

It easy to make people sound good when its done in a vacuum with out numbers.

tl;dr: Repost, bad, kids are bad.


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Bloodpaly

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Senior Member

06-07-2012

People always go straight to the no sustain/hardcc/mobility argument, but they forget that
1. Darius bullies most tops out of lane starting at an early level.
2. Very few tanky dps can fight him at any point in the game cause dat bleed dmg, true dmg ulti, massive armor pen and dat 200% dmg aa reset W on a short cd once bleed stacks happen.
3. Any squishy grabbed by him is probably dead w/o flashing.


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Excited Guy

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Senior Member

06-07-2012

Wouldn't have been so bad to increase the CD and the ult reusable for the next 5 secs only. He snowball way to hard with that ult refresh. It's like he just killed you in lane and he's ready for another killing blow when you come back to your lane.


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Joell Ortiz

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Senior Member

06-07-2012

yeah one guaranteed kill would be garbage
by design, he needs to get 3-4 every fight or he isn't doing his job


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ZodiacsClockwork

Senior Member

06-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by FromageEnroulent View Post
if his ult just DIDNT refresh?

worst case scenario, if he'd be underpowered because of it, tweak another ability to give some more utility. make his slow sap movement speed like malphite, or give him armor/mr for every champ hit with Q. maybe if his ult kills a champion, nearby champions are slowed?

honestly i think he would be fine with just the ult nerf. the sheer power of it allows for a definite secured kill on even the tankiest champions.
or make it go on cooldown for half the time :3


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FromageEnroulent

Senior Member

06-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybaulticus View Post
Because he has a Silence, a speed boost on command, a damage-reducing shield, naturally high armor and MR, heavy AoE damage that scales off AD and Crit, and his ulti is specifically designed to kill one dude, and one dude only.


If Darius had half the stuff Garen had -and- the ult refresh, then you'd have an argument.
are you trying to argue that Garen is stronger than Darius, and therefore shouldn't have his ult refresh on kill?

max rank, Garen's spin does not do more damage than Darius'. the AD garen will have will not compensate for Darius' 50% more damage on the edge added with passive damage. not to mention garen has to be on the enemy the entire time for it to be effective. Garen's also does 50% damage to minions, not a big deal but basically darius spins harder.

Darius has a slow, Garen has a silence/speed boost. late game, Darius' W will do more damage than Garen's Q, the movement speed is basically opposite Darius' slow. the only thing Garen has is the silence here.

Garen has a straight damage reduction on his W with a long cd. Darius has a decent range, cone-shaped pull on a shorter CD. in this situation, Garen is way tankier, but provides nothing for his team for doing so. Darius can seriously cripple a team with a good pull, not to mention it stops you from getting away from him.

Ult? lol, dont need to go into details here. i would like to add that besides the staggering damage difference and refresh, Darius' ult is a short range gap closer.
-------------------------------------------------

you could probably argue who brings more for their team, in some situations a silence would be better than a slow, and DR would be better than a pull. but the sheer damage Darius brings is amazing utility on its own

Darius > Garen.


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Alphazonex

Senior Member

06-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hashinshah View Post
Because garens ult doesnt require 5 stack of passive,
Garen wishes his ult did at least physical damage and scaled with AD.

BUT NO,JOKES ON HIM. AP SCALING AND DEALS MAGIC DAMAGE,HAVE FUN WITH THAT

Darius gets AD scaling AND dealing true damage on his ult. The stacks cease to become necessary because you'll get them low before you get 4 or 5 stacks on them. His ult doesn't require you to get 5 stacks period. It'll still do a lot of damage with out a single stack just because its an AD scaling true damage ability.


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Cixcixcix

Senior Member

06-07-2012

Your pretty much already dead if his ult refreshes.