Darius is easier to counter than you think

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BP Jester

Member

06-06-2012

Gragas is a big counter against him btw. I like to troll Darius baddies all the time with him. Second they get close enough to cs you barrel them. your passive sustain counters his passive dmg and with dash you can easily get out of any pulls. Kayle is another good troll pick against him. Usually double his cs within in the first 5 minutes with both picks


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Etherimp

Senior Member

06-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Khimaera View Post
He has the fourth highest armor in the game at level 1, with average scaling. His health is average (only 29 less than Garen) and scales very highly (only 3 less than Garen). His MR is 30 like everyone else, and he has scaling on it. His movespeed is average. His damage is normal for a physical bruiser, and has the eleventh highest scaling in the game. (Higher among bruisers, since Amumu, Alistar, Rammus, and Morgana have some of the highest scaling for some reason.) Garen has slightly higher HP/5 with less scaling. Darius is higher or equal to Garen everywhere but health.

For abilities, Garens legendary E (which, notably, requires 3 seconds of CHANNELING, whereas Darius' equivalent Q is a one swing deal) does 150 damage at level 1, and 630 damage at 5. The total scaling is 4.2 per AD. This seems high, but remind yourself Garen is not doing anything else but channeling this. Garen's Q is 30 damage at 1, and 90 at 5 with 1.4 scaling per AD. The cooldown is 12 seconds at 1, and 8 at 5.

Darius' Q, equivalent to Garen's E, does 105 at 1 and 315 at 5, with 1.05 damage per AD. Again, remember that this takes a sixth of the time to deal it's damage, and add in 2.5 seconds of autoattacks. I'm pretty sure the damage evens out at the LEAST. Darius' W (equivalent to Garen's Q) does +20% of your AD at 1, and +100% at 5. This looks worse than Garen's. But then, look at the cooldown - it STARTS at 8 seconds, and at any point in the game, even level 1, can be down to 3 seconds. You equal his level 5 cooldown with 0 stacks, and are only a third of it at full stacks, making it FAR outscale Garen's in any engagement over 4 seconds.

I didn't even bother to compare ultimates, since that should be obvious. I also ignored their passives, Garen's W, and Darius' E because these are all fun, different, and hard to quantify in comparison to eachother. I believe those things are all equal between them, which would get me some flak from Darius haters I'm sure.

Next time you ask someone to bring the numbers, ensure that those numbers don't completely render your own argument obsolete. I didn't mean to derail this thread, since it IS a thread on counter-strategies, but denying his strengths altogether does NOT help you counter him! You need to accept he is stronger than other champions in order to fight him properly. Knowledge, not wishful ignorance.

EDIT: I uprated you regardless of your faulty beliefs, because you provided your ideas on the matchup and contributed to the discussion after your little bait

Darius's AD

54 at level 1

Garen's AD

61 at level 1


According to LeagueCraft, both characters get 3 per level, and somehow Darius ends up with 1 more than Garen by level 18.. Not sure how this happens exactly, but the fact that Garen starts with more is indisputable.

Of course, as you stated, Darius starts with 2 more armor. 24 vs 22. I'd say the additional 7 AD at level 1 and the fact that Garen has a shield which passively increases his armor and MR more than nullifies the fact that Darius starts with slightly higher armor.

You already agreed that Garen has higher health... But your argument falls flat when you say "Everywhere BUT health", as clearly Garen's starting AD is significantly higher.

As far as their ability vs ability matchups, I'll concede that Darius has higher damage and more spammable abilities, if you concede that Garen has much higher survivability and escapes.

Darius is an "All-in" champion. If he engages upon someone, he must win that engagement or he will die.. And even if he does escape, he has no way to recover his HP/Mana. Oh, and, his abilities COST mana.. A lot of it.

Garen however, has abilities which costs NO mana.. And he can pick and choose when to stay engaged and when to escape a fight. And when he escapes he can stand around for 15 seconds or so and pick another fight with you with as high or higher health than he started the original one with.

I am not attempting to make this a "Garen vs Darius" thread... Only pointing out that Darius's stats are NOT spectacular. His abilities do high damage, yes... But that's just about all he has going for him when comparing him to other top lanes, which is very relevant to the matter of countering him on top lane.

Personally I play him as a jungler for the same reason I would play Xin Zhao or Tryndamere as a jungler instead of a solo-top... They are high damage, all in champions... Which is to say, they are not as easily countered when they're jungling and they make much better gankers than they do survivable top laners.


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