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Some simple Volibear playability thingies

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A bouncy Furret

Senior Member

12-20-2012

I come back from the movies to see 6 more Volty posts :O!

A new function for his E could be a combo move of sorts, something to help him stay in melee range (unless each hit of his new ultimate slows the target)


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Knight of Dusk

Senior Member

12-20-2012

You know what he should get to stay in range? FEAR. Being able to fear minions in a bloody AoE for 3 seconds but just being able to slow champions? By an amount that's not even all that impressive? Such a tease.

Also, this thread is now linked to over at Surrender@20.

WOOWHEE, this thread actually is doing things. Thanks to everyone who helped bump it and kept the discussion going throughout all the billions of 'bump' posts. And especially to Ursa, for making and maintaining the thread ;D


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Gath Immortal

Senior Member

12-20-2012

Personally I never thought voli had many issues, as a tank he is fantastically strong early game, his only real setback is his scaling. Once at lvl 3 voli can easily take down enemy champions, but he rapidly falls off because his Q has no scaling, his W is unreliable and his E is a one shot nuke with a long cooldown. His R is his only source of continuous damage, it's weak, short range and lasts less time than Kayle's E.

Personally I think voli would be fine as a Tank Nuke, most of his damage should be relegated to one ability with a long cooldown as it already is, while his CC and utility like his Q stays low damage and short on CD.

1v1 at low level volibear is already extremely competent except against other champions who excel in 1v1 like Jax, I would like to see him remain a single-target eliminator with the bonus of being able to tank for his team while his damage is down, his damage abilities just need to be more reliable.


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objecti0n

Junior Member

12-20-2012

Quote:
Volty:
Thank you everyone who has contributed to the discussion! I really appreciate your input and especially the varying points of view.

So big update:

I talked to Morello today, we have a gameplan to move forward with into testing. All skills will remain in very recognizable forms, but with some significant changes aimed a solving some specific issues. Without disclosing all the details, these are the goals (and some of the solutions.)

- Avoid pitfalls of the fighter role, including binary performance entirely dependent on closing to melee. In plainer terms, we want Volibear to reach melee somewhat more consistently but not become massively threatening until he spends a little bit of time there first.
- Ensure jungle viability.
- Clean up scaling, probably by removing AP in favor of other stats. (Health scaling to remain.)
- R cast while moving, enough said.

I also discussed our approach with Live Design, who are enthusiastic about the direction.

I will try to get the changes into playtest soon, and will post more updates as I can.


you sir are a gentleman and a scholar


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Rossingol

Recruiter

12-20-2012

Quote:
Volty:
Thank you everyone who has contributed to the discussion! I really appreciate your input and especially the varying points of view.

So big update:

I talked to Morello today, we have a gameplan to move forward with into testing. All skills will remain in very recognizable forms, but with some significant changes aimed a solving some specific issues. Without disclosing all the details, these are the goals (and some of the solutions.)

- Avoid pitfalls of the fighter role, including binary performance entirely dependent on closing to melee. In plainer terms, we want Volibear to reach melee somewhat more consistently but not become massively threatening until he spends a little bit of time there first.
- Ensure jungle viability.
- Clean up scaling, probably by removing AP in favor of other stats. (Health scaling to remain.)
- R cast while moving, enough said.

I also discussed our approach with Live Design, who are enthusiastic about the direction.

I will try to get the changes into playtest soon, and will post more updates as I can.


<333 Volty


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Luninareph

Senior Member

12-20-2012

I am VERY excited to hear about this. I love Volibear and would love to see these changes you're talking about go live


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IS1351da9d847deb64a63e1

Junior Member

12-20-2012

I just now saw this thread, and thank god for the volibear love since it is my favorite champ.
I play him regularly, and even have a smurf where I only play volibear on rankeds (im from euw):
http://www.lolking.net/summoner/euw/23720979
And my main:
http://www.lolking.net/summoner/euw/19682428

Having played regularly volibear since he came out, here are my thoughts:

1º - Before all, volibear has some animation and clunkiness issues, very harmful for a melee champion who has issues with kitting. Most of his spells have some standstill animation and remove the auto-attack target. After you Q a champion you should remain auto-attacking it, after you W a champion you should continue auto-attack, and the ultimate is just clunky.
Overall, this makes volibear playing a right-click fest to ensure he doesn't wander off his target.

2- His cooldowns feel plain bad. He is an all-in champion, mostly because of his kit, but also because of his huge cooldowns. Once you go in, you burned everything that would allow you to disengage. While this isn't really a bad situation, Voli ends up feeling bad late game when you can't W more than once or twice in a fight, when Q (as your main mobility mean) is pretty much used for engaging only.
This all translates into bad scaling for volibear on anything but tankyness, since you can't use your spells very often, even with decent amounts of CDR.

3º- He has some problems with engage. Not that it is bad, but when a clear situation appears, you have to Q, and maybe ultimate and just charge forward. Maybe even spend a flash for a fast throw. Now, what happens alot of the times, is that for some reason, it isnt a good situation anymore, and your "preparation" leaves you with a running bear with a lot of downtime on his engage (due to Q huge cooldown).

4º- Attack animations feel powerful but are just plain long. It makes landing a W impracticable when you get slowed, and with Q cooldown so long, most of the times you end up missing your W because you try to peel as much as possible before it. I do feed a small range buff would be appropriate. Think of irelia before the E stun buff. Volibear feels like that right now.

5º - His ultimate feels great on the early levels, but just plain bad later on. Specially since atk speed is so hard to come by on s3, his ultimate feels useless mid-late game. I think switching the AP to AD scaling would fix this up. And a few seconds duration and/or some kind of cooldown reduction would feel great. Something like reducing cooldown on hit (like skarner) or assist/kill cooldown halving to make it more usable on fights.

6º- He lacks a real atk speed item. He had both ionic spark and stark's fervor who took care of his atk speed needs on s2. He now has absolutely no GOOD item to fill that gap. Maybe with some AD scalings, zephyr can take this place even though it possesses no defensive stats. But right now, even zephyr feels somewhat bad.

7º- His Q feels buggy. the throws don't work very well sometimes, throwing people forward and sideways. It needs to be more reliable and throw to the other side of volibear and not behind where he is facing.

Overall, I like playing volibear and his kit. He has some quality of life issues with ranges and animations and some serious scaling issues with any spell but his W. He is a fun champion though, and I don't feel like a remake is needed here. He just needs a few adjustments to feel and play good.

I play volibear on Top, Jungle and Support. His best position is top, where I play him even on competitive (ranked teams and esl tournaments) rather successfullly. But I feel that only happens because I main him so much, and all my efforts go into make him viable, not a monster like when someone mains a viable champ (froggen anivia, diamondprox leesin, wickd irelia).


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DriveBy Murdyr

Junior Member

12-20-2012

You sir, have got yourself another supporter. Good to see voli getting some attention :P


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Iohet

Member

12-20-2012

Quote:
Volty:

2. Make the spell worthy of a cast time. This could be by adding another mechanic, like a material chunk of upfront PBAoE damage. Could even collapse the E into the R as a single (cast-time) spell and make a new E.

Thoughts?



E is necessary for the early jungle to mitigate some damage and his only wave clearing ability that is not his ultimate, so if you replace it, it should be something that has comparable utility.


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Crimson Zerker

Member

12-20-2012

Personally, I started Voli as a jungler, then bruiser top. I currently play him as CC support on bot. ... I've won a lot of games doing this. I hope these changes can actually make this odd, yet fun, role still viable.