One Tier List to rule them all

First Riot Post
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WaterD103

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Senior Member

06-17-2012

I want to point out some of the disagreements I have with your tier list. These champs have no action/way lower action on the US or EU tournaments, than your tier list imply, why is this disagreement?

Kog'maw: somewhat picked in EU, almost never picked in US

Ashe: Almost never picked in EU. I can't recall other than my team picking ashe in US tournaments.

Vayne: Though very popular in EU, I never see vayne in US.

Fiora, Lee sin, Varus, Nocturne

All champs that you just don't find in tournaments of US/EU.

I would expect that champs that are so high as Pantheon/Rammus, would have more representation. Why do you think these champs that you regard so high have no presence almost in US/EU competitive metagame?


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Icosa

Junior Member

06-17-2012

When making this tier list is there a particular build you had in mind when ranking Jax? for top or bottom?


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Cauldrath

Senior Member

06-17-2012

When was the last time Rammus was played in tournament? When was the last time he won? (Last I remember was also Yomi.) It seems like he instantly went from permaban to not considered at all because people just realized he wasn't that great and had just been banning him all along because that was the rule. Strong single-target CC and good speed, but weak initiation, almost no CC outside his taunt, and his survivability takes a big hit with Last Whisper and Void Staff being so much more common. He can lock down 1 opposing champ in a team fight, but then can't really do anything about the other 3.

Nocturne was in the last tournament and did pretty well, with being able to ult up to fights and still make it back bottom in time to keep from losing it. Being able to block vision is really powerful, too, if used well.


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Koravel

Senior Member

06-17-2012

Good post, but I gotta disagree about Hec. I think he's a great Dom play, just build him like you would Wukong. Sure there a few champs better, but he's a good pick with the versatility of his skills.


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Pistol Girl

Senior Member

06-17-2012

APRIL FOOLS! this tier list is a joke.


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Sauron

Senior Member

06-17-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaterD103 View Post
I would expect that champs that are so high as Pantheon/Rammus, would have more representation. Why do you think these champs that you regard so high have no presence almost in US/EU competitive metagame?
Tournament picks usually prematurely counterpick ranged ADs right from the get-go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Icosa View Post
When making this tier list is there a particular build you had in mind when ranking Jax? for top or bottom?
This build that I've been running for a while now:

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=1837994

I dubbed it the "piecemeal crit" build in my guide, because I was lazy and couldn't think of a better name.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cauldrath View Post
When was the last time Rammus was played in tournament? When was the last time he won? (Last I remember was also Yomi.) It seems like he instantly went from permaban to not considered at all because people just realized he wasn't that great and had just been banning him all along because that was the rule. Strong single-target CC and good speed, but weak initiation, almost no CC outside his taunt, and his survivability takes a big hit with Last Whisper and Void Staff being so much more common. He can lock down 1 opposing champ in a team fight, but then can't really do anything about the other 3.

Nocturne was in the last tournament and did pretty well, with being able to ult up to fights and still make it back bottom in time to keep from losing it. Being able to block vision is really powerful, too, if used well.
Point Defense ran Rammus in the DD tournies just three weeks ago actually, and several times in the tournies just before that. Rammus generally doesn't get picked against Pantheon, Lulu, Ezreal, and now Darius. Malphite is preferred, but there's nothing wrong with Rammus other than him being fairly boring to play.

Nocturne is more of a 1v1 champion, but he relies too much on proper timing of the shield in order to initiate on most squishies. He can be good, but whether or not he gets through to the enemy in skilled play is somewhat random. +5 was looking to pick him up as an alternative top/bot laner before we settled on Maokai as a top/bot backup.


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Insípid

Senior Member

06-19-2012

If katarina is tier 3 and im always first place with her(even ahead of jax) then someone is doing something wrong. Or im playing to good for kats tier.


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DiscworldDeath

Senior Member

06-19-2012

The thing that's wrong is you pay attention to points. Check RiotNome's thread about fixing the point system here. Right now the point system is not only non-indicative but misleading.

And if you mean you have more kills than he does, then that's also meaningless.


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Pvt Spaghetti

Junior Member

06-19-2012

Your item tier list is no good, but the items in particular that you ranked that is totally baffling is the prioritization of Thornmail over Sunfire Cape.

Thornmail provides 100 armor with NO health to back it up. And the 30% magic damage return is easily shrugged off by AD Aspeed champs because all aspeed champs build lifesteal, which almost completely negates the thorn-like damage. The thorn damage also implies that the enemy is attacking you, which is almost not the case most of the time when the enemy is prioritizing the damage dealers. It is also important to note that the return damage is only procced by auto attacks.

Sunfire Cape provides 45 armor on top of 450 health. Sunfire is the ideal tank item because it gives the much needed combo of health and armor. And the 40 fire damage aura is always dealing damage to anyone within 400 range.

Another thing about thornmail is that anyone who adopts this item immediately gains an invincibility mentality. People think its the end-all, ultimatum of defense so much so that they don't think twice about face-checking or diving team fights.

Of course your item list is flawed because you have to divide priorities between tanks, damage dealers, etc. Not to mention each champ operates differently.

Im not saying leave Thornmail in the dust, either. If anything build it last when AD Carries have probably snowballed and their damage is at their best, which also translates to the Thornmail returning its max potential damage.

But of course the general consensus for the build of tanky champs should be the following; the items vary by champ style of course, but these items should be prioritized:

Randuin's Omen
Sunfire Cape
Guardian Angel
Frozen Heart (the aura is invaluable)
Odyn's Veil (its like the buffed version of Thornmail because it provides health and mana, and has return damage for AP damage)
Shurelya's Reverie
Rylai's Crystal Scepter


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LadysKnight

Senior Member

06-19-2012

You realize that Sunfire is just about the most inefficient item you can buy right? Your argument that LS counters thornmail on its own is also rubbish. It counters it, if I'm standing still and taking it like a *****. However if I'm fighting back, you suddenly aren't gaining back the health I'm dealing because you have thorn damage to account for now. Thornmail costs less and gives more armor so if already have a chunk of health built (RoA, Phage etc. with any Prospector's item), I would likely rather have the extra 55 armor and the passive that will net me more damage in the long run. All this at a cheaper price.

Thornmail is even better early game than late game. Why save it for when they snowball? Shut them down on square one, make them useless all game.