Revive a bit too much in Dom?

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Ahhhh Crap

Senior Member

05-16-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glorious Bird View Post
If excuses were candy we could feed the whole world.

2 Revives negates 2 Death counters. That's what the skill does. Not sure what you want me to explain to you about it. It's quite clear.
so revive prevents you from having died twice? awesome.


I'll keep on not dieing though


P.S- for those of you saying *but dieing is just how it happens!* I'm going to politely say BS to you and tell you to improve your strategy skills. If youd like to actually discuss this I'd be glad to share my pointers, as well as listen to yours. If you'd like to go "neiner neiner youre wrong and I'm right and all my buddies who agree with me agree with me" then I'm going to respond with "well I'm rubber and youre glue".

Cheers.


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Basoosh

Senior Member

05-16-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahhhh **** View Post
so revive prevents you from having died twice? awesome.


I'll keep on not dieing though


P.S- for those of you saying *but dieing is just how it happens!* I'm going to politely say BS to you and tell you to improve your strategy skills. If youd like to actually discuss this I'd be glad to share my pointers, as well as listen to yours. If you'd like to go "neiner neiner youre wrong and I'm right and all my buddies who agree with me agree with me" then I'm going to respond with "well I'm rubber and youre glue".

Cheers.
I have two points:

  • Take, for example, the widely regarded best and highest Elo Dominion player, Sauron. This guy has an absurd ~75% win rate. That's insanity. Then look at the amount of deaths in his match history. If his current match history isn't a big enough sample size, just monitor it for a few days. The trend will continue. He dies plenty. And, despite a couple Hobbits getting through Mordor unnoticed, this guy has incredible strategy. I can go right down the Top 100 Dominion list on lolmatches, and every player on there is going to have several deaths per game. I can also tune in to the weekly Dominion tournaments and see top players dying on a regular basis in those games. All of this evidence combined with my own experiences tells me that death is an inevitability of Dominion. I will have multiple opportunities to use Revive every game. One simply cannot argue that they will not be dead while playing Dominion.
  • If you aren't dying at all in a game, your team is crushing. Stomping. Likely 5-capping. Every time I've had a game where I didn't die, we annihilated the enemy team. If matchmaking has put me up against competition that inferior, I honestly can run anything I want for Summoners and win. One person running Ignite, Ghost, or whatever over Revive is not the difference between your team 5-capping the opposition and losing.

Claiming that you will not be dead is just not a valid argument against Revive. If you're going to denounce Revive, you have to weigh the merits of it against other Summoners. Is the ability to jump back into a close Windmill fight better than Ignite? Is the ability to save your mid from capture in the late game better than Ghost? That's the gray area. Your current argument, however, is black and white territory - and you are arguing against the obvious truth. You will be dead plenty. If you are not, your team has already won a landslide victory, so who cares what you ran?


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Ahhhh Crap

Senior Member

05-16-2012

in the first post I mentioned on this, I clearly said I die an average of 3~5 times a match. Thats what I was using as a ruling post. In such a case, revive is going to help me out maybe 2~3 times a match. However, if I'm playing smart I'm going to die less often, and especially less often at late game, thus I'm going to get to use revive realistically once or twice.

I'm suggesting that a spell that you get to use once or twice and that requires you to have failed, is not as useful as an offensive spell such as exhaust, flash, or ignite. Youre right, its a grey area determined by how you play- again, my suggestion is that dieing less is going to give your team a better chance of winning as the other team will be less fed, and less coordinated as they try and chase down members of your team.

It should be worth mentioning again that I'm not discussing tourney play. I'm also not a sauron nuthugger like half the sheep in here seem to be. If an argument is going to boil down to *but sauron does it that way!!* then its not an intricate argument, its an appeal to an authority (false IMO, but would be entirely correct to call him a valid authority as well.)

Again- i'm not advocating playing a 0 death strategy. I believe rather that a goal of zero deaths, though not likely to happen, is the ideal goal. A strategy that employs an offensive gameplan while also attaining a minimal amounts of deaths is my suggested method for winning in dominion. Revive does not sufficiently benefit that plan.


I didn't re-cap all these points in follow up posts to save time/space/etc. Thats all.


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inFe eD

Senior Member

05-16-2012

A goal of zero deaths? What? The only way to achieve that, especially with pure glass builds on champions like Sion (which you seem to favor), is to play like an absolute coward and force your team to 4v5. You're not going to win very many games like that, but your K/D will be pretty!

Dying is often beneficial to your team, especially since this isn't SR where the winning strategy is to play defensively and turtle-farm your way to victory. Whether you're the only one taking it on your team or not, having Revive is incredibly good top, and absolutely indispensable bottom.


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Ahhhh Crap

Senior Member

05-16-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by inFe eD View Post
A goal of zero deaths? What? The only way to achieve that, especially with pure glass builds on champions like Sion (which you seem to favor), is to play like an absolute coward and force your team to 4v5. You're not going to win very many games like that, but your K/D will be pretty!

Dying is often beneficial to your team, especially since this isn't SR where the winning strategy is to play defensively and turtle-farm your way to victory. Whether you're the only one taking it on your team or not, having Revive is incredibly good top, and absolutely indispensable bottom.
the games I die more tend to be the losses though, funny right?

Oh well, I'm off to find some more gamers using revive so I can get some more kills and control the map better, cheerio thread


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BigDaddyDelish

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Senior Member

05-16-2012

I don't always take Revive, especially if a lot of people on my team have it. But it's still a VERY good spell on Dominion, provided you use it right.

For bot, if you don't have it, you are in huge trouble. You need to take Revive because the whole point of taking bot is to not get your ass kicked and lose it, a Revive/Garrison combo is pretty critical for that.


It's very helpful for the Windmill fight, but a lot of times when I take it I don't even pop it when I die for the Windmill. If I know my team will take it, I save it, and wait for a better time to use it. That's the main thing about Revive, using it optimally is very critical to not having it become a liability. You can use it probably about 2-3 times most Dominion matches, which is way less than using something like Ghost/Exhaust/etc. that you could have taken in it's place, but when you do use it you can make a very VERY big difference.



The comparison to flash on sr is a good way of thinking about it. I don't think it breaks the mode, but it adds an interesting dynamic and I'm glad that revive has found a place in a game that otherwise completely ignores it's existence.


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Infirc

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Senior Member

05-17-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahhhh **** View Post
lmao- the key to winning in dom is to be the team that dies the most. Right.
No Revive is useful to save and keep the sitch because there's no surefire way you'll stay alive in Dominion.