Morello - This is a serious issue and you are responsible

First Riot Post
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chrisreehlSCHMEA

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Senior Member

03-03-2012

bump


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Hawkeye

Senior Member

03-03-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElPotatoDiablo View Post
I'll say it again, real slow like.

K/D/A is irrelevant. W/L ratio is irrelevant. These are based on a number of variables that cannot be determined.

Base stats are relevant. Eve has the worst base stats in the entire game. By the numbers, Eve is the worst champion in the game, and therefore picking her puts your team at a disadvantage due solely to her having the worst base stats in the game. This is relevant because her base stats are a constant, they do not change from game to game.
Okay, you only want to look at base stats. Eve is the worst. Now how about the 2nd worst? 3rd worst? 4th worst? 5th worst? Those all put your team at a disadvantage too, right? How come Eve is the only one that will guarantee that your team tries to force a dodge, trolls you, rages and reports you?

Should teams only consist of the best champions in the league? There are 94 champions. Should anyone picking a champion in the lower half expect flames for putting his team at a disadvantage? The reasoning isn't sound.


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The Black Rose

Senior Member

03-03-2012

Getting sick of Riot working on supports and champions who don't have that many problems. There are too many champions who just cannot be accepted and played in today's meta.
But here's the concept Riot has to wrap their head around.
Patching every 2 weeks to put in a new champion will NOT balance or help balance the game.
It's just more work you have to do to balance that newly made champion (as well as the others you have forgotten about).


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Xelesta

Senior Member

03-03-2012

Still no reds?


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ElPotatoDiablo

Member

03-03-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
Okay, you only want to look at base stats. Eve is the worst. Now how about the 2nd worst? 3rd worst? 4th worst? 5th worst? Those all put your team at a disadvantage too, right? How come Eve is the only one that will guarantee that your team tries to force a dodge, trolls you, rages and reports you?

Should teams only consist of the best champions in the league? There are 94 champions. Should anyone picking a champion in the lower half expect flames for putting his team at a disadvantage? The reasoning isn't sound.
No, I only want to look at what matters to the discussion at hand.

No one is making a comparative argument here, so the base stats of any other champion is irrelevant. The argument being made is that Eve has been nerfed to the point of being the worst champion in the game with the promise from Riot that this will change when the Stealth Rework/Eve Rework is finished. That was nine months ago. It is high time for some action to be taken by Riot on the matter of Eve, be it a fix or removal from the selectable pool of champions.

Eve is the only one that forces a dodge/troll/rage/report because it is widely known throughout the playerbase that Eve is by far the worst champion in the game and was purposefully nerfed to that point by Riot as a temporary measure while they completed the rework (which at the time of the nerf was reported as only being a matter of particle effects, which now we all know is clearly some bull**** lie that Riot fed us).

Stop trying to introduce elements to the argument that have no place here. We are not discussing how Eve performs in the hands of a highly skilled player. We are not talking about how Eve performs in comparison to other champions with weaker base stats. We are only talking about Eve, and the ludicrous amount of time Riot has taken to address the problems revolving around keeping Eve as a selectable champion long after the time has passed to expect a fix.


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ITown

Senior Member

03-03-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElPotatoDiablo View Post
I'll say it again, real slow like.

K/D/A is irrelevant. W/L ratio is irrelevant. These are based on a number of variables that cannot be determined.

Base stats are relevant. Eve has the worst base stats in the entire game. By the numbers, Eve is the worst champion in the game, and therefore picking her puts your team at a disadvantage due solely to her having the worst base stats in the game. This is relevant because her base stats are a constant, they do not change from game to game.
Ashe

Health 395 (+79)
Health regen. 4.5 (+0.55)
Mana 173 (+35)
Mana regen. 6.3 (+0.4)
Range 600
Attack damage 46.3 (+2.85)
Attack speed 0.658 (+3.34%)
Armor 11.5 (+3.4)
Magic res. 30 (+0)
Mov. speed 300

Evelynn

Health 414 (+86)
Health regen. 6.95 (+0.55)
Mana 180 (+42)
Mana regen. 7.1 (+0.6)
Range 125
Attack damage 48 (+3.3)
Attack speed 0.658 (+3.84%)
Armor 12.5 (+4)
Magic res. 30 (+1.25)
Mov. speed 315


We're talking base stats right? Because Ashe's base stats are absolutely worse than evelynns. Why don't people ragequit when people play ashe?


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ElPotatoDiablo

Member

03-03-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ITown View Post
Ashe

Health 395 (+79)
Health regen. 4.5 (+0.55)
Mana 173 (+35)
Mana regen. 6.3 (+0.4)
Range 600
Attack damage 46.3 (+2.85)
Attack speed 0.658 (+3.34%)
Armor 11.5 (+3.4)
Magic res. 30 (+0)
Mov. speed 300

Evelynn

Health 414 (+86)
Health regen. 6.95 (+0.55)
Mana 180 (+42)
Mana regen. 7.1 (+0.6)
Range 125
Attack damage 48 (+3.3)
Attack speed 0.658 (+3.84%)
Armor 12.5 (+4)
Magic res. 30 (+1.25)
Mov. speed 315


We're talking base stats right? Because Ashe's base stats are absolutely worse than evelynns. Why don't people ragequit when people play ashe?
You are neglecting abilities, ratios on abilities, and vastly underestimating the value of that 600 range. You give Eve 600 Range on her autoattacks and greater than that on an ability that's AoE, usable without a target selected, and spammable and suddenly things change dramatically.


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Hawkeye

Senior Member

03-03-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElPotatoDiablo View Post
No, I only want to look at what matters to the discussion at hand.

No one is making a comparative argument here, so the base stats of any other champion is irrelevant. The argument being made is that Eve has been nerfed to the point of being the worst champion in the game with the promise from Riot that this will change when the Stealth Rework/Eve Rework is finished. That was nine months ago. It is high time for some action to be taken by Riot on the matter of Eve, be it a fix or removal from the selectable pool of champions.

Eve is the only one that forces a dodge/troll/rage/report because it is widely known throughout the playerbase that Eve is by far the worst champion in the game and was purposefully nerfed to that point by Riot as a temporary measure while they completed the rework (which at the time of the nerf was reported as only being a matter of particle effects, which now we all know is clearly some bull**** lie that Riot fed us).

Stop trying to introduce elements to the argument that have no place here. We are not discussing how Eve performs in the hands of a highly skilled player. We are not talking about how Eve performs in comparison to other champions with weaker base stats. We are only talking about Eve, and the ludicrous amount of time Riot has taken to address the problems revolving around keeping Eve as a selectable champion long after the time has passed to expect a fix.
So.. basically you're agreeing with me? In my previous posts I already said I want Riot to fix or disable Eve.

What I was arguing against (and you became involved in) was the people who said, "If you pick Eve you're intentionally gimping your team and therefore you should expect to get flamed." And my argument was that picking any number of champions puts your team at a disadvantage, and yet only Eve is the one who people say, "If you don't want to get raged at, don't play her."


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Ytinasni

Senior Member

03-03-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElPotatoDiablo View Post
I'll say it again, real slow like.

K/D/A is irrelevant. W/L ratio is irrelevant. These are based on a number of variables that cannot be determined.

Base stats are relevant. Eve has the worst base stats in the entire game. By the numbers, Eve is the worst champion in the game, and therefore picking her puts your team at a disadvantage due solely to her having the worst base stats in the game. This is relevant because her base stats are a constant, they do not change from game to game.
By your flawless logic there is no reason at all to play anything less than the top 10 champions in the game based on their base stats.

Get out.


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ITown

Senior Member

03-03-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElPotatoDiablo View Post
You are neglecting abilities, ratios on abilities, and vastly underestimating the value of that 600 range. You give Eve 600 Range on her autoattacks and greater than that on an ability that's AoE, usable without a target selected, and spammable and suddenly things change dramatically.
k, lets compare abilities

ashe has a slow from her autoattacks
evelynn has a stealth that can slows her target (with a cooldown less than 1/3 of ashe's)

ashe has a vision revealer
evelynn reveals terrain with stealth

ashe has an aoe slow

ashe has a long range skill shot stun/aoe slow

evelynn has a low damage spammable dps skill that synergizes with sheen/lich bane

evelynn has a stronger version of master yi's steroid

evelynn has an armor/mr shredding ability


k, clearly their skillsets are entirely different. Now that we've established that, I don't see how you can assert that ashe's skillset is better.