Morello - This is a serious issue and you are responsible

First Riot Post
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Thryale

Senior Member

03-15-2012

So, why was eve nerfed so hard, but twitch still left quite powerful? imo, twitch has always been far more annoying than eve ever was. They were both squishy yes, but once eve's stun/slow wore off, it was easy to escape from her, twitch can just keep pounding you as you run.


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Validan

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Senior Member

03-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by RCIX View Post
That's the thing: You have been a lot more open than other companies as far as describing what works, but why can't we hear more about your progress? Like a weekly/montly/wheneverly post that goes through the publicly known todos and lists the sorts of progress made on them (and why, if none was done). I know it'd kind of hard to explain when something doesn't get work, but it's a step forward :X
This please!


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bahamutkaiser

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Senior Member

03-15-2012

Well I'm impressed enough that this has been addressed and acknowledged, simply getting acknowledgement that its a priority again and addressing shortcomings and new attempts is a long way. And even talking about the subject and deliberating problems and concerns your having is better than not saying anything because you cant remark on progress, this very subject itself has in the past proven why that is a mistake.

As for priority, it is true that overall game health is more important than a single champion, but the reason this is a priority is because you kneecapped a champion and told us you were working on it, and emphatically stated it would be fixed, and didnt, the integrity in question is what was really a concern and why it was unacceptable, but I'm just as glad to forgive you if you'll acknowledge it and try to remedy it. As should we all, because there's no point being here if we are just going to be mad and nothing will pacify us.

Since you cant remark on whats in progress and when it will be available perhaps you'd favor me with some opinion on possible alternatives. Is it necessary to fix Evelynn and twitch with completely self balancing mechanics?, the ward sweeping concern is up for review too. What about replacing oracle with cheaper temporary revealing techniques, what about creating cheaper, less thurough stealth detection effects for a ward to replace vision ward, like a ward that just indicates presence but doesnt reveal or even show opponents, like the effects with terran sensor towers in SC2?

What about spreading several partial and complete detection effects across a handful of skills in the game, like clarvoyance, or on a few champions like Corki old bomb or adding it to one of Lux skills, or adding a permenant passive to warwick to notice units near him with detection but not actually reveal them, that, and a hand ful of others added to the mix of a few that already exist like Lee Sin, and maybe some activates on items, could change the nature of stealth as a whole to a less binary nature.

Making stealth self limited to all encounters is a little broad, but if even 15% of champions had a form of stealth revealing, or just some partial detection that doesn't necessarily reveal, but does warn them, than, and with a few item options just in case, stealth as a whole could remain more threatening to some, and be more vulnerable to others, naturally, and more interactively, like nidalee trap.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justus Dominus View Post
People don't seem to comprehend the difficulty of reworking something like stealth. Stealth is binary in nature. You either can be seen or you cannot be seen. How do you rework something that really has very little grey area?
^
By making a grey area.

I just think the amount of work going into an entirely new system, for two champs, that will self limit them vs all opponents, and not addressing the warding and detection method together, doesn't work out to a best solution, but perhaps you could share your thoughts. Thank You.

PS its a touch phone, overlook my spelling.


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Sinornim

Senior Member

03-15-2012

Excellent, an AD caster item. Urgot will be pleased.


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bahamutkaiser

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Senior Member

03-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrJadaris View Post
Why do you guys post stuff like this, when you know full well it's untrue?

If you play a lot of Eve, and you get enough reports for "playing Eve" to send you to the fully automated, crowd-sourced Tribunal, and they vote to punish you, you will get banned. Everything but permabans are Tribunal automated, you guys have already said so...
First of all, their very specific about bans vs suspends... So if he says "bans" don't occur for playing Evelynn, he means "bans"...

Secondly, this does not account for the amount of player abuse and counter abuse that occurs related to playing Evelynn, which may result in players getting ban or just suspended based on separate... Yet related actions...

I'm sure he ment what he said.


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Thallium81

Member

03-15-2012

I think Riots just learning from it's mistakes, and bumbling along.
Not all of us are children and realize that you make your money from new champions and skins.
The more champions the more choices players have to make on where to spend IP and then eventually RP. If you had 10 champions in the game a person may only want to play 3-5 of them, which is easy to do with IP. If you have 200 champions a player may want to play the same 30-50% percentage, which is now 60-100 champions. Now a player will likely have to spend money on RP to obtain those champions. As a company I understand your motivation behind that.

Where you went wrong I think is in balance and game modes.
Balance is obviously going to be difficult with so many champions and the rate of champion release. A balance issue also arose when Riot changed the way champions were built around AP back in the day compared to today. That caused a separation/balance issue all of its own.
Game mode issues I think fall mostly on the amount of resources put into Dominion (and also TT, but to a much lesser extent). The issues with Dominion in my eyes is you created a whole other game mode, but within that game mode you created another balance realm, where certain champions had to be adjusted to fit into the game, items had to be adjusted, and there are even new items exclusive to that game mode! Balance nightmare!

Your forces are spread too thin on the front lines Riot. I guess that is what I'm saying.


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Turtlerocket

Senior Member

03-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
Well, bans don't occur over this - you can reported "for playing Eve" all day, and we won't ban for it.
I thought only permabans were reviewed by an actual Rioter.
ಠ_ಠ


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Xpyder

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Senior Member

03-15-2012

i have a similar story... but instead of getting afk and reports... i carried my team to victory....
so... the champion is weak, sure... but 3 afks and many reports, is that a problem with the champion of with you?


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AR Manimal

Senior Member

03-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
The community on the forums wants that (and I think players do also), but it's actually not more important than everything. There's a much bigger picture - champions, for example, do a lot more for player engagement than even long-awaited reworks. It's a hot topic, but that doesn't make it the most important thing in LoL
I'm just gonna throw this out there, a lot of people would rather have new features such as new SR style maps, achievements, portraits and better balance in general than new champions being pumped out every 2 weeks.

IMHO you guys need to take a break from creating new champs after you hit 100 champs total and start putting things into the game that will help it in the long run. New champions every 2 weeks are obviously going to make you quick cash but this destroys the game in terms of balance and does little for the game in the long run compared to updating features such as the ones I mentioned.


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L0NELEE

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Senior Member

03-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotMontag View Post
We are thinking about solutions for both Twitch and Eve. Our design team is bouncing around a lot of crazy ideas, and most of them are insane and aren't fun yet. We'd rather only talk about the stuff that is fun, the stuff you'll actually get to see in the game.

we waited this long, Ive expected we were past the "idea" stage...

Eve 2012