How to create better gameplay, better quality players, and torture trolls.

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DoubleSin

Senior Member

01-02-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by redrum248 View Post
50,000 ip = about 400-600 won games wich is a crazy price just to plAy on a map wich would suposedly have better people ... besides just play rank if you want to play your lvl kind of people.
Problem is that ranked is still infected with so many trolls that it is no longer a solution, it is now the problem. The idea is to bring quality players and separate them from trolls.

As far as Tribunal being harder to judge, can you elaborate? I don't think I see how my solution contributes to that. People already lie, but I think by creating more filters as described in the OP, you are able to separate those who troll from those who are genuinely interested in playing the game. Some people just have bad games, but they get reported because of it. This will add some emphasis to that, because everyone in the game will know that in order to play in this arena they had to meet some requirements. You know that every person you are paired with and playing against has met a level of criteria that I think we have all come to expect of our fellow level 30 summoners. I don't think I ever go into a ranked game not expecting that a summoner has rune pages for their champions, has some basic knowledge of how to juke and some basic knowledge about how all the other champions work. Right now you can reach level 30 and end up getting paired with people who do not meet this criteria.

The prerequisites may need some minor modification or tweaking, but I think the fundamentals of what I am trying to get across is there. That is that joining a ranked game I do not think it is unreasonable to expect the following:
1. Rune pages.
2. A history of games played without issues (significant reports).
3. Diversified champion knowledge.
4. Decent background game experience beyond just reaching level 30.

Plus I am not eliminating the current normal games. Everything is still as normal if you wish to play there. I am just suggesting an additional game mode that I think would be a positive influence on the community here. There's no way to permanently remove bad behavior, but through powerful incentive you can shape how people desire to behave. Make the positive outcome of this arena worth more than the pathetic joy someone gets out of ruining 9 other people's game for 40 minutes of their life.


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posidenii

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Recruiter

01-02-2012

If people get reported no one will be allowed in this special map. You just gave the trolls more ammunition to ruin you game experience by reporting you. Your solution will just flood the tribunal with more non-sense reports even when you have a good game.

Also you are baiting the trolls to flood reports on good players because they know these people want a troll free environment.

The question should be how to separate trollish behaviors from normal/ranked game play. There really is no "troll" just bad behavior. Warnings and banning is the current solution to correct that behavior. You have to suggest something that beats the current solution.


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Tanzra

Junior Member

01-02-2012

some people are such losers that they troll you with the intention of making you fall behind just so they can harrass you more and report. The reason why ppl do this is because some ppl can't take criticism very well and will try to prove that they are superior to you by leaving you behind (and then call you bad when you die) in situations where they can easily fight and come out ahead. I've seen games where my team would make sure the AP carry never got blue buff even once the entire game because they thought he was to cocky.

And it is much easier to troll AD since all you have to do is AA and steal CS while pushing the lane at the same time... oh ya, jungler can be even worse sometimes. Some noobs constantly ask you to run halfway across the map to gank and if you fail you fall behind on farm.

I guess the point i'm trying to make is that the better the player is the more critical they are of perceived mistakes. And pros don't all think alike either, so a good pick/strategy one pro comes up with might seem like a noob mistake to another pro player. Even if you play with the best players in the world that doesn't guarantee that there will be no trolls.


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Ailurus fulgens

Member

01-02-2012

if you think there are to many trolls stop complaining get yourself a 5 man team and win. no need for all of this.


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DoubleSin

Senior Member

01-03-2012

I suppose LoL will forever have the worst gaming community then, as it is widely said.

I understand the Tribunal Reporting issue stated above, and I guess my idea may be bait for trolls. As it stands though, there is nothing stopping trolls from doing that now even without my idea in place. I'm sure people commit to reporting someone after every single game like it's a religion even now. I'm not sure that my idea makes the problem any worse or any better in that regard, if people are going to report they are going to do it whether or not my idea exists.

I have seen AAing ADs come to mid lane and screw over the AP carry by stealing exp and farm. There are ways to self destruct your own team, I agree. But I don't think that is always intentional, I think that is the difference between someone who has played only 200 games and got to level 30 vs. someone who worked through ELO over a few hundred games, got shafted and fell to 800 ELO, then rose back to 1200-1300 ELO and is now getting paired with the same fresh 30s. As it stands warnings and bannings really have little meaning. That puts a Troll out of business in the 30s bracket for maybe 2 weeks, but they'll be back in like cockroaches within minutes.

The point of solo/duo queue is to be able to join a game and be entertained, not frustrated by unfair play more often than you are not. I work odd hours so I don't always have 4 other people online at my beckoning call to queue with, that doesn't mean I should not ever play LoL just because the community sucks so bad. I don't feel that is a reasonable solution. Solo/duo queue exists for a reason, if it is broken it should be fixed not detoured.


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xTachibana

Senior Member

01-03-2012

or they can just put a filter in for win/loss ratio :/ after an XX (say 200 games total, AI not included ofc) itll start teaming people by their win to loss ratio, its the easiest way to do it, why should people who are really good and say have a 90%+ win ratio have to suffer with a noob teammate who feeds (not intentionally, at least not always) because he's fighting people way above his class?


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xTachibana

Senior Member

01-03-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanzra View Post
some people are such losers that they troll you with the intention of making you fall behind just so they can harrass you more and report. The reason why ppl do this is because some ppl can't take criticism very well and will try to prove that they are superior to you by leaving you behind (and then call you bad when you die) in situations where they can easily fight and come out ahead. I've seen games where my team would make sure the AP carry never got blue buff even once the entire game because they thought he was to cocky.

And it is much easier to troll AD since all you have to do is AA and steal CS while pushing the lane at the same time... oh ya, jungler can be even worse sometimes. Some noobs constantly ask you to run halfway across the map to gank and if you fail you fall behind on farm.

I guess the point i'm trying to make is that the better the player is the more critical they are of perceived mistakes. And pros don't all think alike either, so a good pick/strategy one pro comes up with might seem like a noob mistake to another pro player. Even if you play with the best players in the world that doesn't guarantee that there will be no trolls.
this can all be fixed if the "oh so great" players would stop talking **** about the not as great players, many times ive been in a game where i do good at one moment, save my teammate, ok he ran away and he's about to teleport, then pops up 2 enemies and i become a martyr for him to safely get away, what do i get? a "**** xin you suck dick, you shoulda ran", as a human being i dont take lightly when people talk badly about me, but ofc im not a troll so i dont just go and quit, afk or intentionally feed the enemy team, i play like always, but maybe i dont save him the next time


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PiIvIpZ

Junior Member

01-03-2012

I think its a great idea. Maby a little less ip because everyone likes to buy new champs. But I like the idea. I have lost at least 50 games this season due to afk 4v5 games . And or 3 of the 5 on my team feed so hard that even when I always own can't carry team out of loss. Elo means nothing . And there are tons of amazing players stuck in elo bell who can't get out cuz teams blow even with a amazing kdr


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Tanzra

Junior Member

01-03-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by xTachibana View Post
this can all be fixed if the "oh so great" players would stop talking **** about the not as great players, many times ive been in a game where i do good at one moment, save my teammate, ok he ran away and he's about to teleport, then pops up 2 enemies and i become a martyr for him to safely get away, what do i get? a "**** xin you suck dick, you shoulda ran", as a human being i dont take lightly when people talk badly about me, but ofc im not a troll so i dont just go and quit, afk or intentionally feed the enemy team, i play like always, but maybe i dont save him the next time
This is not what i was talking about, but i'm glad you brought up this point. When you play with good players they know thatt the primary targets are the AD carry and the AP carry and everyone else on the team will usually go out of their way to protect those two. So if you go out of your way to save them and become a martyr in the process they will consider you a good player because you cooperate with the team.

I was trying to say is that when bad players get criticised by a good player they often take it personally and try to drag everyone else on the team down to their leve. This happened to me in one game where i was solo mid morg with boots and 3 health pots and talon was solo top with doran's blade. i told him that starting with doran's blade top is a really bad idea and he could lose the lane and then he snaps back that i am a noob for not starting with doran's ring on morg.

When i asked the jungler for blue buff at about 9 mins in the game he said no and gave it to talon instead cuz of course i'm a noob and talon is pro so he can get more use out of it (i think they were pre-made trolls). The effect this had on our team fighting should be pretty obvious; without blue buff i had a long cooldown on black shield so i have to be more passive and I couldn't poke as much. i saved black shield for myself in case nocturne dived me most fights instead of using it on an ally unless someone got caught.


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DoubleSin

Senior Member

01-04-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by xTachibana View Post
or they can just put a filter in for win/loss ratio :/ after an XX (say 200 games total, AI not included ofc) itll start teaming people by their win to loss ratio, its the easiest way to do it, why should people who are really good and say have a 90%+ win ratio have to suffer with a noob teammate who feeds (not intentionally, at least not always) because he's fighting people way above his class?
This is already in place with the ELO system. ELO measures your wins in a row vs your losses. Maybe not identical, but essentially the same thing. Now in Normal games it looks like people are paired by their total number of wins as opposed to their win/loss ratio, so this may work for normal games.


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