Dominion: Why do many SR players not like it?

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Nephrael

Senior Member

10-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by ActionButlerGO View Post
Alright, from a number of the responses, a thought just occurred to me.

How many veteran SR players consider League to be synonymous with SR? As in, Summoners Rift IS League of Legends.

Perhaps this is my biggest problem since, being a new player, I'm looking at League as an umbrella under which there is SR, TT, and CS.
As there is no competitive scene in CS at the moment, I don't really see it worth improving my game in it. With summoner's rift there's ranked mode, which i have been practicing for fervently lately

To be honest, yes, until they give me a reason to strive to improve in CS I dont really see it as "league" like i do SR. Doesnt mean i dont like it though!


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McMaster

Senior Member

10-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by ActionButlerGO View Post
Alright, from a number of the responses, a thought just occurred to me.

How many veteran SR players consider League to be synonymous with SR? As in, Summoners Rift IS League of Legends.

Perhaps this is my biggest problem since, being a new player, I'm looking at League as an umbrella under which there is SR, TT, and CS.
Not synonymous with SR, but synonymous with a different style of gameplay.


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Mo Zedong

Senior Member

10-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by ActionButlerGO View Post
So, while I'm waiting (again) for my data to process, I thought I'd ask the question that has been nagging at me for a while.

As SR players, why do you not like Dominion?

My primary thought is that, everyone here came here for SR. That was the initial draw so why switch now? If that is the case, though, I don't get why people feel the need to add such virulence to their Dominion commentary that I frequently see. When the conversations remain civil, though, I've heard a ton of different answers to this question, but the three that really floor me are poor balance, low skill requirements, and boring game play.

Poor balance is probably the most frequent, which I kind of get, but I still don't see. Lots of folks just disregard Dominion saying you only see Rammus, Jax, Akali, Shaco, Poppy, or Heimer over and over again because they are so OP. Well, until last night, I hadn't seen Rammus in two weeks. Jax has been a no-show for close to a week. Are they OP? Well, yes, if you know how to play them they are very easy to get a win with on Dominion. If you don't though, you become an instant liability. I've seen more people play Jax and Akali and end up with **** scores than I have seen end up carrying the game. Rammus is great for disrupting, but throw some thornmail on, take some CC, and he becomes a silly turtle-looking guy who just rolls his way into unwinnable fights really really quickly. Add to the fact that, now that we know that these are strong picks on Dominion, people are now learning how to fight them, so they do not run away with games nearly as easily as they are made out to.

Now... are they OP if the player knows how yo use them? Yeah, probably. But, is that not the case on SR? How many "Akali OP, nerf now", "Cait needs nerf now", "OMG Skarner godmode after buff" threads pop up on GD every day? So, honestly, what's the difference?

The skill requirement is, perhaps, the one argument that I can actually agree to. Is Dominion more casual than SR? Absolutely. Was it meant to be? ...Maybe? Is that terrible, though? Keep in mind, though, this is said without acknowledging the completely different skills required to excel in Dominion. SR demands last hitting, patience, coordination, good teamfighting skills, etc. Dominion requires the ability to adapt to unexpected developments, smart use of sustainability, tactical use of minion pushing, good teamfighting skills, etc. Does playing Dominion make you a worse SR player? Yeah, probably. I know I've had to get back into last hitting mode when I switch back to SR, but it has also made a **** of a lot better at teamfighting and adapting my builds to suit the situation.

The boring argument may be the one that confuses me the most, though. Now, take this with a grain of salt, since I'm new to the genre, but it seems that so much of the typical SR game is already decided before the game even starts that a lot of the actual game play is mechanical repetition. The current metagame seems to rule over every early game decision in terms of who to ban, what types of champs to choose, who takes what lane, when to gank, etc. I have, honestly, read threads on this forum where players have described, in detail, the first several minutes of completely hypothetical SR games stating that, that's how it would go because that's how the game goes.

That just doesn't sound fun to me. I understand that that is how some people here gauge skill, but I would, personally, much rather play a game where things are much more open to improvisation. The Dominion version of the above SR example is, obviously, four top (one stop for mid) and one bot. After that, though, everything seems much more fluid than the typical SR game. There are windmill pushes, bot pushes, ninja mids, and any combinations of the above.



tl;dr: Why do SR players not like Dominion?

EDIT: It hasn't been brought up yet, but, for what it's worth, I really, REALLY do like SR. It does have a more tactical feel to it, but I suppose I just see SR and Dominion as two games that compliment one another and not two that compete.
I know this sounds petty , score shouldn't really matter. But this is a pvp game and proper scoring does matter to me. As such i really feel dominion's score system is meant to cater to care bears. Ive had games where i got "2nd" place because i didn't die as many times as someone else. Not joking about this. I had same kills , 1 more capture then them and 8 less deaths. Yet because you get a bonus for dieing "maytr" he scored first place.


NOW dying for the greater good is valiant and all in truth, but really NOT dying for the greater good is even better. IF i kill the guy trying to take my tower , i am doing MUCH more than the guy that died in that situation. Dominion goes to lengths to hide KDA and seems to really promote stupid game play with its score system. Pick eve , ignore enemies , cap towers Equals winning strategy. Pick Pantheon , wreck people all over the map Equals losing strategy. Its just lame that way imho. I really think more emphasis needs to be placed on killing and not dying. After all that is what LoL , Dota and pretty much all Moba's before have been about. Objectives hold the game together , but if we wanted a pve game we would play Wow or something.


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Lenarin

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Senior Member

10-25-2011

I've played both and "enjoy" both, but I will say that SR is more engaging/rewarding/meaningful. Its like masterbation and ***. sure dominion is enjoyable, quick and good when you don't want any real connection, but it just doesn't compare to the build up and excitement of a longer more engaged session ;-)

Dominion seems all about burst damage. I haven't played tons of it, but its such a small map, that sustained damage, short of catching someone off guard, is far less useful than burstrape. Who can get burstier faster wins. I like the idea, but the map is too small and the spawn times too fast that the whole thing happens before there is any real depth.


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ActionButlerGO

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Senior Member

10-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by LastTestament View Post
This thread
.Point is made
.Op and friends come up with a best case scenario to counter point full well knowing that in most games you will not get that best case scenario

hey you guys like it, it's cool most of us don't.
Just to be clear, I am not criticizing anyone for not like Dominion.


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Duriel

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Senior Member

10-25-2011

Doesn't matter how good you are. If your team is terrible you lose.

It's not like that on SR. If you're 5/0 and teammates are 1/4 you can still carry.


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Cenerae

Senior Member

10-25-2011

It feels more like a minigame than an actual game mode. There's not much wiggle room for counterplay like there is in SR. You can't really shut down anyone on the enemy team because everyone's being flooded with tons of gold even if they spend most of the time dead. All it really boils down to is which team has the most 1v1 or small skirmish specialists, and which team can play their champions better in a strictly pvp setting.

Also, every single Dominion game I've played has felt like every other one. One guy goes bottom and 1v1's the other guy going bottom, everyone else zergs windmill, dies, respawns, zergs windmill, etc, etc. With the occasional deviation where someone does the unthinkable and goes and takes the bottom nodes, before going back to windmill zerging.

The only two things I like about Dominion is that 1) I can try out free week champs without worrying about derping hard in the lane while trying to learn how they handle, and 2) Nobody *****es at me for picking Evelynn on it.

Edit - another big reason for not liking it is that it's only 5v5. With 5 nodes and only 5 per team, it's too difficult to actually come up with a strategy that isn't either 'take and hold 3' or 'take and hold 3 while 1 guy runs around being annoying by ninja capping enemy nodes'


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Geekweezul

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Senior Member

10-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by LastTestament View Post
and quick deaths are expected in fps and encouraged.
A kill in Lol should feel earned and special and matter in the long haul.
In dominion it's less epic and less important.

You comparing apples to watermelons.
Lol wasn't built for people who like domination while cod is a perfect reflection for it.

I would have preferred Magma chamber or a expansion of the game play we have now.
if anything dominion was just a way of riot picking themselves out of the herd not enhancing the core gameplay
Quick deaths are encouraged? What?

Why should a kill feel earned? Killing the nexus should feel earned...and that is the point in both SR and Dominion. And, with your logic, if there is any champ deemed OP in the slightest...you better not use him. Or item for that matter.

I've had plenty of "epic" kills in Dominion. The matches are closer 85-90% of the time unlike SR...where apparently the game can be decided at champion select more than 50% of the time. Yeah, fun all around.

Why wasn't LoL built around a Dominion game type? Because you enjoy 20 minutes of hardcore, heart-pumping, hand trembling....farm? Where if your carry gets fed early it's basically GG?

SR is still fun, but saying LoL wasn't built for Dominion is just stupid.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cenerae View Post
Also, every single Dominion game I've played has felt like every other one. One guy goes bottom and 1v1's the other guy going bottom, everyone else zergs windmill, dies, respawns, zergs windmill, etc, etc. With the occasional deviation where someone does the unthinkable and goes and takes the bottom nodes, before going back to windmill zerging.
I'm sorry...what version of SR are you playing that makes every game different? Because every single SR game I've played has been 1 tanky deeps top, 1 ap mid, 1 jungler, 2 bot (ad carry and support). And don't stray from that because omg meta.


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Nephrael

Senior Member

10-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cenerae View Post
zerg, zerg, zerg
.
Zerg? ZERG!!!! I LOOOOVE ZERG RUSHES!


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ActionButlerGO

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Senior Member

10-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stop Meh Now View Post
It's not like that on SR. If you're 5/0 and teammates are 1/4 you can still carry.
See, this is another point that I have a difficult time with. I've had several games on SR where I have excelled (as in, 11-2-2 as Cait by ~20 minutes) that still resulted in losses because of teammates who had no idea what they were doing and losing both top and bot.