Swain and Tear of the Goddess

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BrotherCaine

Senior Member

08-30-2011

I noticed Swain's Ulti doesn't count as a spell for building up Tear of the Goddess. I was hoping this could be looked as Dominion comes out.

I'm not a huge fan of Rod of Ages and I don't believe it should be cookie cutter for Swain so I don't want to look to Catalyst every game for early mana. If I do get Catalyst it usually turns into a BV later. I want options.

On non SR maps there isn't a blue buff so mana issues have to be solved another way. I like tear because once its built up it allows Swain to brawl in a teamfight, like Rumble.

ANYWAY

I noticed Aniva's ult counts to build Tear and it can be pulsed on and off. Karthas is disabled so I don't know if he can use defile in the same way.

When i'm playing other mages I don't have a problem building a tear up to around 650 before a game starts to be decided around 35 mins max. On Swain I have a hard time getting up to 300 bu 35mins. He only farms creeps with Nevermove and his Ulti so its a rare chance build his Tear up outside of a combat situation. Nevermove has a massive cooldown, preventing Tear spam there; Swain players often leave it as the last spell to level.

Swain has the biggest mana usage in the game, beating out Kassadin argueably with Aniva a distant third yet has the hardest time building up a Tear of the Goddess.

The potencial for a Swain player to pulse his ulti on and off to build a Tear would need to be looked at... but then he wouldn't have his ult ready for a combat situation that might spring up. Anyways. See what you can do.


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3mptylord

Senior Member

08-30-2011

Having infinite mana on Swain would inevitably make him overpowered in Dominion. He would have unrivaled sustain in an environment that's not really designed for that. Swain's ultimate will be perfect for clearing minion waves/disrupting captures. Also, I was aware that HP/5 and MP/5 would be increased in Dominion.

Also, no Toggle ability other than Anivia's ultimate works for Tear of the Goddess. I suspect Anivia's is an exception because she is technically channeling whilst using her ultimate, and it can be disrupted.

P.S. Tear of the Goddess won't be very useful in Dominion. It takes 12.5 minutes to cap with champions like Karthus who can spam 2 abilities every 6 seconds. For anyone who cannot spam, or cannot afford to, 20 minute games won't really allow Tear of the Goddess to be as effective.


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BrotherCaine

Senior Member

08-30-2011

Welp if MP/5 is increased globally then Swain's mana issues won't be so bad. I guess.

He is already getting the -20 healing debuff.


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Octavian1191

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Member

08-30-2011

nevermove should be the 2nd ability you max seeing as decrepify is only useful after you have built rabs + rylais. rush a catalyst always on swain for the lane sustain. learn to turn your ult off and control the damage of your lane. the only time in laning phase you should use your ult is after you successfully hit the snare. in teamfights, only use ult during the first few secs to do initial damage, followed by some e and q spams, then final snare and birdy. no mana issues, still helpful. the biggest issue players have with swain is forgetting to turn ult OFF... the only change i might make, is make it cost more base mana per sec say 50 or 60 at 1 stack, and keep it there, not increase per sec.

edit: also he should be kind of a tanky caster, never ap nuke... so dont expect high damage output early game like brand or orianna... if you want a nuke, play one of them. he should be built with a RoA and rylais and rabadons. those 3 are almost 400 ap, 1k hp, and 600 mana... after that zhonyas or frozen heart (depending on mana situation)... abyssal sceptre or BV(mana again)... and a void staff... that would be what i suggest...


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aRchiBole

Senior Member

08-31-2011

toggles don't activate sheen/tri/lich proc either btw, swains ult is a toggle with a cooldown not a active in lol that almost semantically arbitrary distinction exists


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PhailRaptor

Adjudicator

08-31-2011

The reason Swain cannot activate Tear with his ulti is because procing Tear and procing Trinity/Lich/Sheen are coded the same way, and Riot did not want Swain getting "free" Lich procs every couple of seconds. This was brought up a long time ago, and I haven't heard anything about a fix or change since then.


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Eddiot

Senior Member

08-31-2011

Toggle == only global Cooldown(1 second) between on/off vs Mao/Anivia where they have a cooldown between the end of their ult and when they can recast.


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BrotherCaine

Senior Member

09-01-2011

Swain's ulti isn't a just a global cooldown before he can use it again. It something like 12.5 seconds.

You'll feel how long it is if you turn it on in a fight then turn it off too soon....


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WogerDog

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Member

09-12-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhailRaptor View Post
The reason Swain cannot activate Tear with his ulti is because procing Tear and procing Trinity/Lich/Sheen are coded the same way, and Riot did not want Swain getting "free" Lich procs every couple of seconds. This was brought up a long time ago, and I haven't heard anything about a fix or change since then.
Not sure why Anivia can get the proc then when she can spam her ult faster than Swain. Plus, turning on and off Swains ult just to get Lich procs is just being dumb.