Akali... Nice Concept, Flawed Execution (Especially on Summoner's Rift)

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Somafera

Senior Member

05-17-2010

Survivability?

Yes i get Rylai and use red elixirs.

What else i'm supposed to do? Stack sunfire capes or something?

If she can't deal enough damage, she's not a threat.

There's no "good judgment" when a 5v5 fight is going on, you either stay away and no nothing besides throwing a random kama or laying down shroud making it 4v5, or rush in and instantly die during one CC before you even get stealthed once. Even if someone else initiates and soaks the majority of their cooldowns, its still very easy to burst you down.


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Amarth

Recruiter

05-17-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Voistriser View Post
If you give Akali's ult the ability to target allies, you have an escaping mechanism with a 1.5 second cooldown. Please explain why that is fair.
Because it has only 3 charges with no matter how many ranks you put into it. at rank 3 you are essentially waiting 15 seconds for a charge. In other words, introducing this change to allow to teleport to allies like jax and kat, two melee dps (kat actually has better long range harass due to bouncing blade than alkali) would actually INCREASE the level of skill needed for Alkali because you would have to make a decision between enemies or moving away (each taking a third of your charges).


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Lyrael

Senior Member

05-17-2010

I've tried this, and the towers still detect and hit her anyways.

Eve doesn't count, as while Oracle shuts Eve down too hard (IMO), Eve also doesn't have a predefined area of stealth with a pretty line, which pretty much means that if you don't see her around, she's in the area clearly defined by the colored border.


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Ad Astra per Asp

Senior Member

05-17-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Somafera View Post
Survivability?

Yes i get Rylai and use red elixirs.

What else i'm supposed to do? Stack sunfire capes or something?

If she can't deal enough damage, she's not a threat.

There's no "good judgment" when a 5v5 fight is going on, you either stay away and no nothing besides throwing a random kama or laying down shroud making it 4v5, or rush in and instantly die during one CC before you even get stealthed once. Even is someone else initiates and soaks the majority of their cooldowns, its still very easy to burst you down.
Rylai's is a start. I prefer frozen hammer, it gives way more hp and way more snare.

My build goes
Doran's Blade (+hp and lifesteal)
Merc Treads (+MR and it's passive)
Guinsoos (Main damage item)
Frozen Hammer (HP and Snare)
Haunting Guise (Magic Pen, AP, HP and more spell vamp gives you more survival all around as well as gives more damage)

For my last item I often change it up, but an abysmal scepter isn't a bad choice. +MR, Magic pen, and more AP. I will get Aegis, or other things as well. That's 6 items 5 of which give survivability and 5 of which help your damage.


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JohnnyW

Senior Member

05-17-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyrael View Post
I've tried this, and the towers still detect and hit her anyways.

Eve doesn't count, as while Oracle shuts Eve down too hard (IMO), Eve also doesn't have a predefined area of stealth with a pretty line, which pretty much means that if you don't see her around, she's in the area clearly defined by the colored border.
That's true, but the tower doesn't give sight of Akali to the enemy like it does any other stealth, and if there are creeps around she won't get hit (assuming she doesnt damage an enemy).

Broken IMO....


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Somafera

Senior Member

05-17-2010

Considering that rylai works with all her abilities and also boost their damage, what's the point of getting mallet?

If someone is running away, its very unlikely that you will have enough time to hit them right after shadow dance, while with rylai they are already slowed.


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Lyrael

Senior Member

05-17-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyw4life View Post
That's true, but the tower doesn't give sight of Akali to the enemy like it does any other stealth, and if there are creeps around she won't get hit (assuming she doesnt damage an enemy).

Broken IMO....
You know what, can't say I've ever really tried that. I would question the overall intelligence of throwing down a shroud that you're in right next to a tower, but if it does that, then it needs to be fixed. If I'm going to push hard to fix the broken things about her that would make her better, stuff like this needs to be addressed too.

Anyways...

Items that boost her survivability is good, but I don't really see what's so broken about being able to Shadow Dance to a spot selectable out of a Twilight Shroud. It uses up a charge, and she has to blow 2 cooldowns to do it.

Besides, it also brings to mind the Law of Jax/Katarina: 'If they're running away, they're not hitting you'.

Rylai's/Treads/Ninja Tabi do help her survivability a bit. She still can't really take a hit though (she's Melee DPS, which is fine.... no need to have someone with as high as her damage output actually be even remotely tank like). Those items just help her not explode when someone hits her, which is good.


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Ad Astra per Asp

Senior Member

05-17-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Somafera View Post
Considering that rylai works with all her abilities and also boost their damage, what's the point of getting mallet?

If someone is running away, its very unlikely that you will have enough time to hit them right after shadow dance, while with rylai they are already slowed.
It's a choice, make it for your own playstyle. But yes, you will have time to auto attack them. Rylai's has less slow potential, less survivability, and more damage. I prioritize the survival. Magic Pen, at least until next patch does more for your damage than AP ever does.


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rehspuhkuh

Senior Member

05-17-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyw4life View Post
That's true, but the tower doesn't give sight of Akali to the enemy like it does any other stealth, and if there are creeps around she won't get hit (assuming she doesnt damage an enemy).

Broken IMO....
Pretty sure shrouding next to an enemy tower will reveal you like any other stealth character. I would naturally just throw down a shroud whenever my creeps were pushing the tower (didn't think about it) and the enemy champions would still be able to stroll up and auto attack me while stealth was 'up'. No oracles either in those instances.


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Incineration

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Senior Member

05-17-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Somafera View Post
Survivability?

Yes i get Rylai and use red elixirs.

What else i'm supposed to do? Stack sunfire capes or something?

If she can't deal enough damage, she's not a threat.

There's no "good judgment" when a 5v5 fight is going on, you either stay away and no nothing besides throwing a random kama or laying down shroud making it 4v5, or rush in and instantly die during one CC before you even get stealthed once. Even if someone else initiates and soaks the majority of their cooldowns, its still very easy to burst you down.
Rageblade, Rylai's and Zhonya's is far and away more than enough DPS items on Akali for the times you need survivability.

You know you're going to get crushed if you move in, just wait for your tank to initiate and your ranged DPS to start putting out numbers and Q --> R --> E. If you take damage, throw down your W and gtfo or clean up.

Finish off the medium/low health targets/squishies. If you really have to die for a teamfight to turn out as an ace or a 4 kill, there's nothing wrong with that at all.