How to play Lee Sin mid-late game?

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Farmville

Senior Member

08-03-2011

Hey all. So, I recently bought Lee Sin, my first champ ever bought with RP. I bought him because I love his abilities and the fact that he's an energy-consuming champ.

But on to my question: Is it just me, or does Lee Sin get worse after the early game laning phase? I ask because I have major problems with this. During laning I can go 4-0 with him, and then end the game with a very mediocre score of 5-5 or something of that nature. It's like I'm getting fed early game for no reason since I can't seem to help my team later in the game. I can't say it's my build since I've tried lots of popular ones. It just seems my attacks stop doing much damage later in the game.

I understand how to use him pretty well. Like I said, early game I'm really good with him. I've had people comment saying that I'm the best Lee they'd ever laned with. It's just the most important part, the late game, that I can't get down.

Help me, LoL community! D=


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Jazz Bat

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Senior Member

08-03-2011

Never initiate with Sonic Wave/Resonating Strike for teamfights, let the tank do that. Just focus the carry on their team until they're dead. That's all you need to do in a teamfight, this will help alot mid-late game.
Late game focus on taking Dragon, Baron, and towers. Resonating Strike is the ultimate Baron stealer spell. Do this while waiting for the last teamfight so you can push for the win.


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Farmville

Senior Member

08-03-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazz Bat View Post
Never initiate with Sonic Wave/Resonating Strike for teamfights, let the tank do that. Just focus the carry on their team until they're dead. That's all you need to do in a teamfight, this will help alot mid-late game.
Late game focus on taking Dragon, Baron, and towers. Resonating Strike is the ultimate Baron stealer spell. Do this while waiting for the last teamfight so you can push for the win.
Thanks. I normally build pretty bulky, and follow up to atk after the tank initiates. It seems like Lee Sin isn't really a DPS champ though, and sort of fails in those close combat situations. I have to QQEE then gtfo with W or I'm dead, even with a bulky build (and of course, if I build for high DPS, I'm really squishy; too squishy to do anything). I just feel useless a lot of the time, although on some occasions I get some badass saves with W or some nice multi-hits with my R...

Anyway, thanks for the advice.


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Mejakallu

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Senior Member

08-03-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Y am I bad View Post
Thanks. I normally build pretty bulky, and follow up to atk after the tank initiates. It seems like Lee Sin isn't really a DPS champ though, and sort of fails in those close combat situations. I have to QQEE then gtfo with W or I'm dead, even with a bulky build (and of course, if I build for high DPS, I'm really squishy; too squishy to do anything). I just feel useless a lot of the time, although on some occasions I get some badass saves with W or some nice multi-hits with my R...

Anyway, thanks for the advice.
He's not a DPS champ if you just rush warmogs into the mid game. You get into a similar position as a Mundo or Morde that rushes a warmogs; just a huge damage sponge that's not threatening. This makes you falter late game because you didn't continue being fed.

I used to make the mistake of rushing warmogs after my boots and phage/brutalizer. It's good for beefiness, but you really need to transition yourself into midgame with more damage.

Several things you could try are:

Buy a giant's belt and then just sit on it while you build atmas/trinity/other DPS item

Stack doran's -> atmas

Frozen mallet -> atmas

I think people really underestimate atmas without warmog's/super high health item. Late game, most characters have around 2000-2200 health without any health items. That alone would be 40-44 AD, which is pretty much a BF sword.

If you're melting to casters, get a hexdrinker or a wit's end. The MR and passive on both are great. One gives AD and one gives you magic dmg + AS, the latter scaling better into late game. A single point in E is usually enough for you to shutdown enemy ADs mid game. If you've bought your giant's belt, then a single neg cloak should also be fine, and can be built into FoN later, which I would consider core on him on any team that has any reasonable amount of magic damage.


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Willis87

Senior Member

08-03-2011

If you're lacking in damage try BT, 300 AD Lee sin is scary.


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Farmville

Senior Member

08-03-2011

More good advice.. awesome.

@Mejakallu
I normally go with 1st boots > Phage > finish boots (mercury treads) > Giants Belt > Frozen Mallet > Atmas then normally a Warmog's. Of course this is pretty situation dependent. If I do manage to get all of that, I still feel like I do only mediocre damage.

@Willis87
I may just try a BT... but the question is, where to put it in my build?

Maybe next time I'll go Boots > Giants belt > finish boots > BT and see how well that works.


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Mejakallu

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Senior Member

08-04-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Y am I bad View Post
More good advice.. awesome.

@Mejakallu
I normally go with 1st boots > Phage > finish boots (mercury treads) > Giants Belt > Frozen Mallet > Atmas then normally a Warmog's. Of course this is pretty situation dependent. If I do manage to get all of that, I still feel like I do only mediocre damage.
Consider going brutalizer instead of phage if you really want to get an early game oomph. Costs about much as a phage and makes you much more threatening with the additional damage and armpen (CDR semi useful). Lee Sin already pretty durable and if you can afford a giant's belt that should be enough health to be later turned into warmogs/sunfire/mallet etc.

I'd also advise against getting both warmogs and frozen mallet. Two super high health items is really just overkill. Turning that phage into a trinity would give you a ton more DPS while also giving you done of other stats you can make use of (although having to spend money on mana always sucks). Many will argue that sheen/trinity is even core on Lee Sin since he has so many ways to proc it, meaning it really increases his damage output. I personally don't subscribe to this philosophy and still find it situational, but it's nevertheless a great item and is always worth considering.

And just a small tip, consider delaying your boots a tiny bit. +850 gold is a lot of money that could be spent on longswords, dorans, etc that can really supercharge your early game. It's definitely a balancing act as to when you want your second boots for that extra chasing speed/boot effect, but remember that Lee Sin already has the second highest base movement speed (325) and has two high mobility skills. Level 2 boots only give 20 more MS over the 50 you get from level 1 boots.


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Farmville

Senior Member

08-04-2011

More solid advice, thank you.

I played a few games last night before the servers went down, using advice from this thread, and it has really helped.

What I did those 2 games is start out with boots and 3 hp pots, like normal, but the 2nd item I bought both games was a BF sword and then built it into a BT. Both games I started out 4-0 like normal, so it wasn't long before I was able to afford it. Once I had it, I pretty much snowballed from there and had 9-1 and 13-2 scores.

My new build, situational of course, is now:

Boots 3 HP Pots > BF Sword > BT > Giants Belt > Finish boots > Frozen Mallet > Atmas > FoN > Burtalizer > Ghostblade.

I may get the armor/mr part of FoN or atmas sooner if I need it. With this build I haven't had a bad game yet. I feel it's a very good balance between bulk and power for Lee Sin. You'll have around 300+ atk dmg with very high resistances (with my runes I have about 150 in each end game) and I think around 2.8k hp. Again this varies depending on runes and such.

Thanks for the help all. I became a better Lee Sin literally overnight.


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Mejakallu

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Senior Member

08-04-2011

That's a pretty good end game build and a nice progression. I like the idea of an early BF sword/BT as even though it's expensive to buy, your Q pretty much scales on a 2.0 ratio like your ult, meaning you completely crush people in lane. The vamp scepter you also get gives you mad sustain on top of his W so you become mega powerful. I'm concerned with how squishy you might be in early-mid game depending on how intense the teamfights get, but I have a feeling as long as you play smart and like an assassin you should do just fine.

Also try out gunblade on Lee Sin. The active is a really nice compliment to your E since it's a long range and it's sometimes necessary for when minions or whatever is blocking your Q from gap closing. Also tons of lifesteal, spell vamp, and damage to boot.

This is really why I love playing Lee Sin so much. Along with the fact that he has a super fun and rewarding kit with a decent skill cap, sounds and looks pretty cool, he has ridiculous flexibility in item builds. He's easily my favourite champ right now.


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Farmville

Senior Member

08-04-2011

@Mejakallu

I may give that (Gunblade) a whirl next game.

And he is my favorite too. Like you said, very rewarding to play as and do well with. Also very fun dashing around the map.


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