Heimer's defencive design flaw

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190x7plus7

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Senior Member

07-10-2011

In my opinion, they need to revisit Heimer's playing concept.

His only option early game is to max out his turrets and play defencive, or max out grenade + rockets and lose lane control for added ganking power.

The only problem here is that playing defencive with Heimer is just so much more efficient, and that's where the design flaw comes in. His turrets are very strong (except maybe against Caitlyn) while his rocket and grenade are very lack-luster. That said, his passive further promotes his defencive playstyle. I would be pleased to see Heimer being a more robust champion rather than providing health regeneration to all his teamates.

In other words, from levels 1 to 12-ish, he can literally stop an enemy lane opponent from leaving to gank or playing aggressively, purely because his turrets are his strongest point in that phase

An idea that I'd like provided to Heimer is:
-Leave his grenade and missiles alone

-Nerf his turrets damage (even as little as 5 damage is enough) OR nerf the survivability of the turrets (decrease armour from 50 to 30, MR from 100 to 60) OR both of the above (to a lesser effect, of course)

-Change his passive to something like Lux's passive, but in reverse. Instead, when he auto-attacks someone, he places a 3-4 second buffer on the target, and if hit by his turret/rockets/grenade, to proc extra damage. Probably cap this effect to a 8-10 second cooldown (after proc), and let it scale with AP (very slightly though, or he'll be OP)

-Increase his auto-attack range from 550 to maybe 575 or 600 (to further provide a more robust play-style.

Now there are limitations against this, of course, for example, his attack speed/animation or whatever isn't up to par to support the passive, but these can change with simple things like increased projectile speed etc. But I believe that these changes could turn a somewhat UP, turtle hero into a true AP caster.


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Giltia Zero

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Senior Member

07-10-2011

...are you seriously asking for a nerf to heimerdinger? -1 for that alone, moron.

Secondly, your nerf demand is to his TURRETS. This is, without a doubt, Heimerdingers most basic gameplay concept. Oh, you can't jump all over the super squishy Heimerdinger because he has two turrets out? How tragic! I feel so badly for you. It must be painful to be so bad.

If Heimerdinger pushes, call for a gank. His turrets give him a slight advantage in a 1v1, but in a 2v1 they're absolutely worthless. And if he's pushing, he's Junglefood.

His stun is unreliable and he'll be forced to waste Flash if he still has it up.


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190x7plus7

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Senior Member

07-10-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giltia Zero View Post
...are you seriously asking for a nerf to heimerdinger? -1 for that alone, moron.

Secondly, your nerf demand is to his TURRETS. This is, without a doubt, Heimerdingers most basic gameplay concept. Oh, you can't jump all over the super squishy Heimerdinger because he has two turrets out? How tragic! I feel so badly for you. It must be painful to be so bad.

If Heimerdinger pushes, call for a gank. His turrets give him a slight advantage in a 1v1, but in a 2v1 they're absolutely worthless. And if he's pushing, he's Junglefood.

His stun is unreliable and he'll be forced to waste Flash if he still has it up.
The number 1 reason why Riot do not want to buff Heimerdinger is because of his defencive playstyle. He's UP because without he doesn't give as much to his team other than his turrets. This can be seen when he used to be able to have 3 turrets placed.

Having his whole playstyle based on his turrets isn't healthy, much like how pre-buff Yorick's minions couldn't last 2-3 seconds before being bursted down by area damage during teamfights. By slightly (note: SLIGHTLY) nerfing his turrets, and allowing him to actually gank or provide damage outside of turrets will see his popularity go up, and possibly even fix his current UP status.

Unless you want 50-minute games, I don't think that this, in any way, will dramatically effect his split-pushing ability, and will actually provide him something to do rather than just place 2 turrets down, ulti, then cast the grenade and rockets.


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Jezroth

Senior Member

07-10-2011

if you didin't realise he was more trying to suggest a way to make him less defensive and increase his dmg output...

you didn't even read the post properly


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Lycanblu

Senior Member

07-10-2011

Believe it or not, Heimer's turrets are what a lot of people seem to think aren't strong enough, at least, since the glory days of Heimer are gone.

I'm just one person, but I don't think anyone would want to nerf Heimer's turrets, which as far as I'm aware, a lot of players already think are underwhelming, and would not agree to nerfing them, seeing as they can already be taken out rather easily at mid and late stages of the game, and have various targeting and priority issues that further devalue the skill as a whole. If you're proposing that we weaken the turrets in any way, then we need the 3rd turret back.


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RobertFreeman

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Senior Member

07-10-2011

You DO NOT max turrets first. No. You don't. You build him something like:

QWEQQRWWWWREEEERQQ

His only important turret upgrades are level 1 and 3, as they change the number of turrets he can have out. Increased damage and health and things are less relevant.

His best skill is his W, which, while Upgraded, and with enough AP, can do over 3000 damage. And, if played right, can be focused on one target, at huge range. The w's great range is very handy. If there aren't minions around, get in range, hit w, leave range. Have fun.

His E is good too. Long duration blind really bothers Ashe and friends, and landing the stun is really nice. The slow projectile speed is annoying, but actually helpful for harassing under turret.

His turrets are his main gameplay mechanic. They're just not his best. They're what makes him UP, and they're where the buffs need to come in.


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Get Some 101

Senior Member

07-10-2011

If you max turrets, you're play him wrong anyways. Turtling scrubs max turrets first. You just get 1 in turrets for lane control and then work on rockets to poke and harass.