The Idea of a Tank-Killer

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DarkPlatypus

Senior Member

07-04-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyrea View Post
but i could turn this same argument around then, if tank killers are a bad idea and tanks are are supposed to just cc and soak damage. then tanks should not be able to do large bursts of damage, ex.amumu's ult, etc etc. so if you want tanks to be tanks then lower their damage output so they're fair also.
In that case, make sure EVERY tank has 2-3 hard CC moves to justify the utter lack of damage. Since many tanks don't have that (Malphite, Shen, etc), then don't whine about their damage.


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Kuwalda

Senior Member

07-04-2011

"Tank killers" are supposed to be other tanks and supports with CC. Requiring a damage dealing tank killer will result in, as the OP said, those characters being even more powerful vs squishy foes.

But in LoL, lots of tanks need to be countered directly (i.e. by killing them), because they deal too much damage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkPlatypus View Post
In that case, make sure EVERY tank has 2-3 hard CC moves to justify the utter lack of damage. Since many tanks don't have that (Malphite, Shen, etc), then don't whine about their damage.
Well Mumu has 2 hard CC moves and crazy damage. Alistar the same. No wonder they are considered the best tanks atm.


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1vhuZ71qkXu6AkRT

Senior Member

07-05-2011

it imposible to lower tank dmg since then they would be no treat and no one will attack them ,tanks here arent tanks in wow, if riot want more complex game they should make tanks here like tanks in wow


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SleepingDragonZL

Senior Member

07-05-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkPlatypus View Post
In that case, make sure EVERY tank has 2-3 hard CC moves to justify the utter lack of damage. Since many tanks don't have that (Malphite, Shen, etc), then don't whine about their damage.
At no point was i whining, isnt a forum a place of discussion and debate. Making my argument in a debate isnt considered whining.

Also to continue this debate, these "tanks" (ex.jarvan,alistar etc) do way to much damage for their role. Also this "fighter" title on champions needs to be changed to tank, cause alot of them tank as well as the tanks (ex.singed ( no singed does not do to much damage) ). There is simple fixes to champs like amumu, that would completely balance them out. For example remove the damage off amumu's ult this would not remove its usefulness but prevent it from half healthing carries....and also prevent stupid ult combos like amumu and kennen which can wipe out most of a team on sheer damage.

Remember im here debating, so debate with me. not throw insults and accuse me of "whining"


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idioSyncr4zy

Senior Member

07-05-2011

Wow... people complain about the disparity between how much skill is required and the results gained by rolling tanky dps teams. Then Riot comes out with a single champ that has a good counter to this strategy. one. and suddenly all those tanky dps players cry foul.

Honestly I think Riot should have taken the time to better balance how MR and Armor work, how much those items cost, etc but I think Vayne's true damage mechanic is a solid short term counter. She essentially forces tanky dps to pay attention to positioning. The mechanic doesn't do the true damage up front, so it forces Vayne to stay in range. The problem with Kog is that his damage could be mitigated by MR. The problem with something that does damage based on MR or Armor is that then the tank would just build Warmog's and then build a ton of Armor/MR and not feel a thing. I think a mechanic like this would be a good one to exist in the game, but Vayne's current mechanic is far superior.

I understand a tank's role is to disrupt, protect your carry and soak damage, but even tanks need a counter. All I can say is that I think people need to adapt.


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Skither

Senior Member

07-05-2011

One of the main reasons tanks are so tanky is because, along with the armor they build, they usually have a build that increases their defensive stats. Also, tanks are pretty much dead in this game. I haven't seen Rammus, Shen, Amumu, or any other tank in a while besides perhaps Alistar. The game needs to be reorganized.

Also, AD carries are very effective against tanks nowadays and there use to be a "tank killer". Kog'Maw was pretty effective at it. But why would you take a champ that has one job and completely destroy him? As far as tanky DPS goes, it can be countered. If tanky DPS just wins the game automatically, why don't I just see every tanky DPS champ in high ELO anymore?


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Gilder

Senior Member

07-05-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyrea View Post
but i could turn this same argument around then, if tank killers are a bad idea and tanks are are supposed to just cc and soak damage. then tanks should not be able to do large bursts of damage, ex.amumu's ult, etc etc. so if you want tanks to be tanks then lower their damage output so they're fair also.
This is flawed because tanks should be able to 1. have a chance of killing people 1v1 and 2. have enough of a threat to make people want to attack them.


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SleepingDragonZL

Senior Member

07-05-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilder View Post
This is flawed because tanks should be able to 1. have a chance of killing people 1v1 and 2. have enough of a threat to make people want to attack them.
tanks can 1v1 without high burst, an example of this is shen he doesnt have a large burst like the rest of the tanks/tanky dps(singed excluded) and ive seen him 1v1 just fine.

there is a fine line when a tank has to much damage. this is understandable and i know makes balancing hard. but also this should not lead to people crying foul about 1 counter champ.

also thank you for debating not flaming


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trancepticom

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Senior Member

07-05-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by axesandspears View Post
I'm going to keep this short and simple.

-Any champion that kills tanks fast will also kill dps fast.
&
-Tanks need to be able to survive large bursts to do their job.

Therefore: Tank-killers would virtually remove the effectiveness of tanking and serve as carries that could kill everything else quickly, turning this into a carry-only game in a short amount of time.

I understand tanks need to be killable, but it needs to be hard to kill them, currently, the difference between true tanks and dps is about right (vayne might be a bit much though) and no new champion should be designed purely with killing tanks in mind.

Thank you for reading and commenting below.



you should check out trundle. ult on any tank = squishy


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RedViperGG

Senior Member

07-05-2011

Vayne and Kog are here.