@Riot Rational Shaco Requests

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Phonike

Member

06-25-2011

OK well there is still solo que for ranked games so you could still argue he has utility there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prometheius View Post
Except the game IS balanced around making ranked accessible for EVERY champion.
I do not think every single champion is balanced around being ranked accessible because there is a large list of champions that are never even considered in ranked games not to mention the other end of the spectrum where the same champions always get banned. Why is this? Because some champions are better for ranked play and that is OK. If not then surely Alister, Rammus, and Amumu would have been nerfed by now because they are the best for ranked play. So from a strictly ranked game standpoint they are not really balanced which makes sense since the game is not balanced around ranked gameplay.


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Agron0m

Senior Member

06-25-2011

You pubstomped some people who have no idea what you are doing?Good job!Remember seeing him at Dreamhack?No?Well think about that.

A champion is considered OP or UP if he does his job better than other champs or worse than other champs.Nocturne is a better shaco in ANY WAY POSSIBLE the only good thing shaco can do is counter jungle and possible kill the other jungle while still having a way to escape.Its not like Noct cant go in your jungle and take your red buff at lvl 1 and then camp in your bushes while killing your wraiths.

Shaco also has very low damage for his squishyness.Low HP and armour.His SHIV scales with 0.5 of your AD and thats **** lategame.His clone is easely killed since it doesnt have buffs on it.Your traps get weaker as the game goes on since they die with 1 hit.Shaco is good but as more the game progresses he gets weaker and weaker.And sorry i have had a 6 win streak with AD veigar that doesnt mean that he is good or viable in mathes where players arent ******ed.


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Phonike

Member

06-25-2011

Well clearly you ignored the majority of the thread, but let me reiterate.

Shaco and Nocturne are not like comparisons. Shaco is actually much much better at escaping than nocturne. His dps is comparable. He also can save teammates much more effectively.

There is a large number of champions didn't make an appearance at dream hack that doesn't mean they are underpowered and it doesn't make the ones consistently banned overpowered. From things you have issues with it seems like you may not be using him correctly. These were not games where I waited till I got my desired records. I wanted to make this post so I played 5 games and posted the first 5 results because I consistently do well with him.

I am at a loss I really cannot see your point of view, in my experience shaco only gets stronger late game. I don't know what else to say other than I respectfully disagree.


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Agron0m

Senior Member

06-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phonike View Post
Shaco and Nocturne are not like comparisons. Shaco is actually much much better at escaping than nocturne. His dps is comparable. He also can save teammates much more effectively.

I am at a loss I really cannot see your point of view, in my experience shaco only gets stronger late game. I don't know what else to say other than I respectfully disagree.
If i wanted to play a champion that ha good "escapes" i would pick ezrael corki tris.The fact that you can "escape" doesnt mean you are good at anything else.

His DPS is comparable to nocturne?Oh yeah he totally has a Nuke + Damage buff + Free banshee + ATS buff + A damage + disable skill and a dash from the other side of the map.With noct most squishy champs dont even come out of your fear.With shaco you cant even fear them.

How can you save a teammate with shaco?You die in their place?With noct you have a nice damage nuke and a fear that most people will try to get a way with?Oh are you talking abou the traps that take 1 hit to die?Yeah they can save people...yeah.

The "he only gets stronger" lategame thing makes me think you are some kind of troll.Even Reginald thinks that if you have a shaco you need to win the game as fast as possible.Late game he dies way to fast.

Stop trolling and stop smurfing.


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GalacticFlame

Senior Member

06-25-2011

There are no points to these Shaco threads. Personally, I think Shaco does need buffs. However, Riot is completely and utterly ignoring these types of threads, which is quite frustrating. All I want is a champion spotlight video of Shaco doing well, against a good team, not some brain dead teams.....


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Shakari

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Senior Member

06-25-2011

This post NEED to be a troll!!!

1 - we arenīt ASKING FOR BUFFS, we are asking for FIXES! For u know difference: RIOT made Shaco with his skills, these skills arenīt working, os itsnīt fine! When u buy a champ, u see the release, then buy! But, if the release donīt tell u what real happens???

2 - your commentary about RANKED was ridiculous! Ranked game is the same GAME, with 5 champs! FIT is about champs combinations, like a team with Twitch, Shaco, Eve and more 2 carries! The combo is bad, but u CAN`T say, oh no this champ doesnīt FIT RANKED...if he doesnīt FIT Ranked, u are just saying, "this champ doesnīt fit VICTORY".

3 - About your score, means nothing! I donīt know your teamates AND the opponents! Because of this, RANKED is the best way to say anything about a champ.
**IF when u pick your champ, like Shaco, your teamates beg to you do not, and if u just lock THEY QUIT, this is UNDERPOWER!
**IF a champ is BANNED ALWAYS GAME, this means he is OP, like Rumble!!

Thereīre champs that are OP but u can counter, like Xin, but OP is a "question" about their Ratios and "kit", while BUG is an "ask" for a FIX.

For finish, Eve now is NERFED UNDERPOWER , Shaco is BUGGED! Ask for fixes, then if u think is OP, ask for nerf! This is balance!


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Shakra

Senior Member

06-25-2011

there is a problem with shaco, and i love him so don't say i'm a hater and that ****. the thing is that if you buff his health / survivability, he will be able to escape every single time. the only time you can actually catch a good shaco is when deceive is on cooldown and you have a stun, otherwise you don't have the time to burst him down. (that is if you aren't a fed burst mage). one of the main reasons he got nerfed so many times is because he could do just that, escape every single time. though, like some other people said, just escaping isn't enough. he needs a survivability increase to actually help in a teamfight. right now he's a cleanup crew / push bot because he just doesn't have the stuff to make it through the first wave of damage.(unless you build tank and then you have a damage problem)

now for the damage part, his damage got nerfed because it was too high at the lower levels, always netting him kills and giving him a snowball that's far too easy. if you were to increase his damage it would result in the same thing, him snowballing. and being even stronger than a shaco that would snowball currently.

this on a sidenote, nocturne right now is definately stronger than shaco because nocturne can deal the same amounts of damage while itemizing part damage part tank items. having this said, pure burst is still in shaco's favour, deceive alone deals more damage than nocturne Q and ult together. the shiv deals more than the fear but just slows instead. nocturne on the other hand has a free banshee and an actually reliable fear. shaco has no steriod skills beside his clone. the problem with this clone is that it's too easy to see which is the clone and which is shaco, and the damage it does, even if you have lifesteal isn't added to shaco. while the steriods nocturne has help him to steal even more life, adding to his survivability

in all honesty, they should opt for bug fixes and stuff, and they should find a way to increase his damage only lategame(which is impossible if you would touch deceive scaling or whatev because it doesn't have basedamage)

now on the next issue, shaco has a pretty good push as in, i place a jitb here and there, maybe a nest, maybe a few wards(mind you, a leveled nest is always handy to have around, even without AP) and you can overextend to their base while maintaining a security that's off the charts. because of this he can just push and push without actually having to deal with the consequenses all the other champs have to deal with(besides TF, / maybe pantheon)

TL;DR
Shaco has an extremely hard to balance kit, most ways of buffing will end up in alot of forum QQ.


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SU kluklu

Senior Member

06-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shakari View Post
**IF when u pick your champ, like Shaco, your teamates beg to you do not, and if u just lock THEY QUIT, this is UNDERPOWER!
Fail logic.
People will never acknowledge another's skill, it's quite sad. You all openly admit that Shaco is useless yet when this guy dominates with him you just say it's because it's a normal game? Ranked game mentality is the funniest thing ever. All ranked game players always think they're the best and always think they're better than non-ranked game players.

My hats off to this guy... what a pro


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Agron0m

Senior Member

06-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shakra View Post
now on the next issue, shaco has a pretty good push as in, i place a jitb here and there, maybe a nest, maybe a few wards(mind you, a leveled nest is always handy to have around, even without AP) and you can overextend to their base while maintaining a security that's off the charts. because of this he can just push and push without actually having to deal with the consequenses all the other champs have to deal with(besides TF, / maybe pantheon)

TL;DR
Shaco has an extremely hard to balance kit, most ways of buffing will end up in alot of forum QQ.
the "pushing aspect can be said about every champ that has invis too.


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Shakra

Senior Member

06-25-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agron0m View Post
the "pushing aspect can be said about every champ that has invis too.
harder to counter shaco than any other invis, this is because shaco has built in wards with a fear, a clone that while it doesn't hold up for long, can be used to confuse an opponent occasionally and best of all, he has a blink spell with an added invis. which makes it harder for oracles to catch him.