How do you build Jax on Twisted Treeline?

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TiV3

Senior Member

04-05-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by PatMcGroyne View Post
P.S Ninja Tabi and Phantom Dancers are dumb because Tabi + You skill = dodge cap so your PD is wasting that 20% dodge chanche which you pay a lot for... If you still want the movement speed and criticals just stack zeals (About 3 zeals for 1 PD).

That means

60% atk speed 30% critical strike and 24% movement speed

compared to:

45% attack speed 30% critical strike 20% dodge(wasted) and 12% movement speed

IMO Zeals much> than Phantom Dancers
There is no dodge cap. (But I don't like PDs either; or attack speed builds on jax..)


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Eppa

Senior Member

04-05-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by PatMcGroyne View Post
P.S Ninja Tabi and Phantom Dancers are dumb because Tabi + You skill = dodge cap so your PD is wasting that 20% dodge chanche which you pay a lot for... If you still want the movement speed and criticals just stack zeals (About 3 zeals for 1 PD).

That means

60% atk speed 30% critical strike and 24% movement speed

compared to:

45% attack speed 30% critical strike 20% dodge(wasted) and 12% movement speed

IMO Zeals much> than Phantom Dancers
There is no cap on dodge only it's multiplicative so each dodge item is worth less then preceding dodge item.

I go Dorans blade, Dorans blade, boots1, Rageblade, Merc or Tabi, Atmas, Bloodthirster.


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TiV3

Senior Member

04-05-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eppa View Post
There is no cap on dodge only it's multiplicative so each dodge item is worth less then preceding dodge item.

I go Dorans blade, Dorans blade, boots1, Rageblade, Merc or Tabi, Atmas, Bloodthirster.
Dodge actually keeps its value per item (always lowers effective average received phys damage by dodge%) while for example CD reduction gets more valuable with each CD item (untill cap).


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KillerMind

Junior Member

04-05-2010

Dorans Ring
Ninja Tabi
Rageblade
Atmas
all 3 elixers
and if it hasn't ended yet i go for a bloodthirster :=]


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futmeK1VYvImO7RT

Senior Member

04-05-2010

jax is op, u can build him as u want = win


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Eat dat chammich

Senior Member

04-05-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by nocomment View Post
jax is op, u can build him as u want = win
Hmmm....then why did I lose a game yestarday when the Jax on my team went 2/11/4 on TT?


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PatMcGroyne

Senior Member

04-05-2010

Jax isn't really OP people just needed a while to get used to him and figure out how to counter him... He is good for high teir play but not OP and I read somewhere that the dodge cap was 40% and it was a fairly credible source i.e Not from riot but someone who has been playing since Beta


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TiV3

Senior Member

04-05-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by PatMcGroyne View Post
Jax isn't really OP people just needed a while to get used to him and figure out how to counter him... He is good for high teir play but not OP and I read somewhere that the dodge cap was 40% and it was a fairly credible source i.e Not from riot but someone who has been playing since Beta
But that's wrong, CD reduction caps at 40%.
Dodge doesn't cap at 40% it just stacks worse than CD reduction, so you can never reach 100% (since each dodge chance is considered individually instead of just adding all flat dodge % values)
Seriously, even one of Katarina's skills gives flat 60% dodge. It's not caped at 40%.


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Shinkuhadoken

Member

04-05-2010

my first few games were a mixed back on TT then i began to master the map itself. mind you only a few of the losses were just that people played better than my team, mainly because pub people suck a ton of the time and dont listen. that and one team was wick, mundo, and karth with wall of pain owning us all it was not nice(premade) made me sad panda.

first item i go with 90% of the time is dorans shield. the other 10% i have tested stuff but found the dorans shield to be best. so DORANS and a health pot.

then i build to ninja tabi, after that if i have enough before going home i grab a vamp scepter too usually im around lvl 6 by this point so i have ulti.
i usually also take the top lane pwning and poking with Q if its safe while jungling th eASy doggies/golems by levle 3-4 ish.

i will definitely never stick to the same plan on this map, if the enemy is harrassing or looking for ganks u have to coordinate with your team to make sure they are ok allowing you to either stay in the lane (outleveling the opponent) or go help and pwn kill them getting assist and or kill money.

i go for guinsoo after by this time people really start dying. enough gold could finish off bloodthirster or go with utility type item of choice. i usually get thirster or if game will finish faster than i can afford it just grab a malady or something just to spend the money.


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Mison

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Member

04-05-2010

Ok to put the dodge concerns about it capping to rest I will explain exactly how it works. The ones that say dodge gets worse the more you have are right. This is because it has diminishing returns for EACH SOURCE of dodge. I will provide the math for a common example, sources are:

Tabi = 11%
cs passive rank 1 = 10%
runes = 6.8%

so tabi gives you 11%, then the diminishing return is calculated from 89 not 100 for the next source of dodge and so on, the math looks like this:

100 x .11 = 11% -> 100 - 11 = 89 -> 89 x .1 = 8.9% -> (8.9 + 11) - 100 = 80.1 -> 80.1 x .068 = 5.446 ~ 5.5 -> (8.9 + 11 + 5.5) -100 = 74.6 -> 100 - 74.6 = 25.4%


so in that example you see how the diminishing returns works if you want to calculate how much dodge another source beyond the first gives you, simply take the dodge % apply it to 100 minus current dodge , so for only 2 sources its not that complicated ei tabi and passive rank 5 only is easy to calculate on the fly just 100 - 18 = 82 then 11% of 82 is 9.02 ~ 9 so 9 + 18 = 27% dodge. Not 29% that 18 and 11 add to.

Now that you know how it works you can see for yourself if you think that phantom dancer is worth it, heck 20% is always a nice easy one to plug into the equation on the fly. However my opinion from testing and knowing the math behind it is the dodge you get from Ph. D on Jax isnt effective enough to merit. You already can stun as fast as the cooldown and mana permit.

Anyway all of the above info has been verified by riot and thru testing, you can check the forums from wayyy back in november to confirm. This also hasnt changed since and wont probably ever.

your all welcome ;D


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