Lissandra the Ice Dervish

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Tom Bombadillio

Junior Member

01-21-2013

Two things:

First, when it comes to recommended champions, more often than not they have just ONE role, and with very few exceptions (ie, Kayle/Nunu). This makes it much easier to learn the champion right off the bat. For example, noobs would be saying "Oh, Ryze is a guy where you spam his spells and build mana," Where his spells are for the inexperienced inconsequential on which you max first. Lissandra, in this sense, doesn't really fulfill this role, in my opinion, simply because of her "versatility."

Secondly, her ultimate, Implosion, is still very overpowered. The massive damage output and high range (Ashe autoattacks, for example, are 600) give Lissandra the ulti of Malzahar, with none of the same potential teamfight capability.
Let me explain. With a supression like Malzahar, Urgot, or Warwick, the ulti's channeling provides fellow teammates to get a good whack at the target. However, with Lissandra's, focusing the target she ulti's would prove to result in less damage, thanks to the enemy buffer and the way her damage is based (how much shield remains). This forces allies to split their focus, which often causes very poor teamfights.
Secondly, the ulti is overpowered when it's just Lissandra against a group of 2 or 3 champions. despite the 35% damage increase, her removal of disables and high range guarantees a full 3 second suppression (not counting tenacity). Additionally, her two forms of shields (one of which has a heal) practically removes any necessary worry of dying whilst channelling. Additionally, enemy champions who aren't suppressed would have a hard enough time cracking the shield Lissandra cast, so their carry doesn't die.

I would recommend some kind of way for the channelling to cease other than through cleanse-like items or abilities (or oranges), and to adjust what exactly happens during her ultimate.

TL;DR Lissandra is to versatile for a standard recommended role, and her ulti is too situational to prove real usefulness in a full on teamfight.


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Trollmaster Cryo

Senior Member

01-21-2013

Lore is screwed up. First, you spelled "Sejuani's" name wrong over and over. After that, you said that once Ashe, Sejuani, and Lissandra were friends. Their people had been isolated from each other from a long time so thus they could not have been friends,


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Strato5

Senior Member

01-22-2013

bump


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StrikerMemba

Member

01-26-2013

Bro. Look at this. I think Lissandra the Ice Dervish is being put into thought process.

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Lissandra


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HereticalWarlock

Senior Member

03-03-2013

Alright, guys thanks for your Feedback. Here are some adjustements, nerfs to be exact!

Hoarfrost now cannot be self-cast to Receive Shield. I aim Lissandra's supportive abilities towards her Allies, not herself. Thanks for pointing out this oversight of mine to me.

Glaze only function as a Normal Spell Shield if Lissandra cast Glaze on herself, without ANY auto-attacks' Damage Reduction while active or Healing when broken.

Implosion's cast range reduced to 575 from 775. Suppressed target no longer take 35% less damage from Lissandra's Allies anymore. I hope this will solve some problems

I really don't want Disables to cut Lissandra's Channeling though. But I will make the Shield easier to be destroyed. For now I will make the Implosion's Shield take 200% damage from all hostile sources, excluding AoE.

If Lissandra stops the Channel, Implosion only deals 50% the accumulated+accumulated damage.
If enemies break the Shield to save their Ally, then 50% of the Base only is dealt

I don't want to nerf Implosion's full potential damage though. High-risk, high rewards. That's the philosophy behind it.

Lastly, I nerf the AS debuff. Yeah I didn't realize it was too high given the risk.


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HereticalWarlock

Senior Member

03-03-2013

Oh, one last thing, I remove the extra damage based on % Missing Health. Potentially 1100 Magic Damage at rank 3 + 1.8 per AP is just too high.

There is a reason why I put the -35% Dmg on Enemy Suppressed by Implosion. It is because Lissandra remains at relatively safe range During Channeling her Implosion.

Nevertheless, I appreciate more constructive criticism though. Thanks for all the supports also!


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HereticalWarlock

Senior Member

03-03-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trollmaster Cryo View Post
Lore is screwed up. First, you spelled "Sejuani's" name wrong over and over. After that, you said that once Ashe, Sejuani, and Lissandra were friends. Their people had been isolated from each other from a long time so thus they could not have been friends,
The Winter's [Claw]'s original name was Sejulani, spelt exactly that way. I had Lissie's Lore + Concept before Riots made those changes concerning Sej. Nevertheless I prefer my own lore than Riots' though. You can always ignore it.

I mean no rudeness towards you. Regards!


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HereticalWarlock

Senior Member

03-03-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hinata Hyuga Dat View Post
That W is ok but I think it will be more ok if it's like the old Kat Q,hit more enemies when you level up that skill,
The damage is too high. I refrain from doing that for balancing purpose.


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HereticalWarlock

Senior Member

03-03-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by AbominableToast View Post

The ulti seems like it can be used negatively, for example Lissandra ulti's a target who Caitlyn is ulting and as a result accidentally saves the enemy. The spell itself is an interesting idea, however she may ulti a target in a teamfight, only to have the enemy saved instantaneously by AoE's. It provides too many options where it is actually the wrong choice to cast the spell. Due to the complexity of the spell, it actually creates a confusion of purpose and counter play. For instance, an enemy team sees their carry get ulti'd. They ideally break the shield and save their friend. But alternatively they might simply target Lissandra, forcing her to abandon her quarry to save her own life, thus making the shield itself kind of redundant. If the shield's strength is too high, it means that attacking the shield is a waste of time, and thus it is simply not a realistic option. This provides false choice for the enemy (similar to Strygwr's ulti). However this cannot simply be combated by lower numbers, else the shield would be cleaned up by aoe spells and be negligible and thus a wasted spell for the caster. It is a fantastic concept, however in reality it doesn't really play out as you would expect.

I apologize if this comes across as rude, I merely play the devils advocate.
Should be fine. I've made some reworks for Implosion.

The Shield now takes 200% from all hostile sources (excluding AoE).

If it is broken, some damage is still dealt, i.e. 50% of its base.

If Lissandra abandons her prey to save her life instead, then 50% of the accumulated strength+base damage will be dealt.

Either way. some damage will still be dealt to the carry Lissandra has chosen, once Lissandra has cast Implosion on them.

Unless it is in a 1on1, I don't think any potential Liss will risk her life just to deal the minimum(125/225/325)/2 damage. She cannot just cast Implosion on the target then run away quickly with impunity. Because I nerf Implosion's range to 575 (well belowmany gap-closers' range); I also make it clear that Lissandra cannot self-cast Hoarfrost to shield herself from enemy's damage. Glaze now will only act like a normal Spell Shield on Lissandra, with no AD reduction or healing when broken.

But still, the idea of a Spell Shield that will make Karthus heal his target when he presses R is really... jaw-dropping, you know?

Regards


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HereticalWarlock

Senior Member

03-03-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Bombadillio View Post
Two things:

Secondly, her ultimate, Implosion, is still very overpowered. The massive damage output and high range (Ashe autoattacks, for example, are 600) give Lissandra the ulti of Malzahar, with none of the same potential teamfight capability.
Let me explain. With a supression like Malzahar, Urgot, or Warwick, the ulti's channeling provides fellow teammates to get a good whack at the target. However, with Lissandra's, focusing the target she ulti's would prove to result in less damage, thanks to the enemy buffer and the way her damage is based (how much shield remains). This forces allies to split their focus, which often causes very poor teamfights.

...

TL;DR Lissandra is to versatile for a standard recommended role, and her ulti is too situational to prove real usefulness in a full on teamfight.
Regarding Implosion, its Shield can only be broken by enemies, not Lissandra's Allies. Therefore, she doesn't need to worry that her Allies will lower her damage output. But maybe I should remove the -35% damage reduction buff for the trapped enemy though.

I do not think her versatility makes for unfit for a recommended champion. Noobs can only play Champion one way, most of the time. So perhaps most of them will think of her as a mage and disregard her huge support potential. Moreover, Sona is recommended, but does she fullfill only ONE role. I think not.