Reworked TF help

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sainthero

Senior Member

03-21-2010

Madreds, frozen mallet, bloodthrister/infinity edge.


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Dr Troll

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Senior Member

03-21-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucchinii View Post
One in PAC is good enough until you max your other skills.

You shouldn't use PAC to farm, you should focus on using its red/gold cards on enemy champs.

I get a Vamp Scept as my starting item because you've got good AS early game, so you're able to heal hp by auto attacking easily. You can use WC to harass the enemy champion to get away so you can keep farming.

SD's 4th hit isn't at all reliable for harassing.
Wild Card has a very long range, so you can harass from far away, while auto attacking creeps to heal hp with a life steal item.

Getting a Malady, not only gives you lifesteal and boost your AS by a whopping 50%. It has a very sexy unique passive, making you do more damage.

SotD's passive is just like SD's. It does extra damage on the 4th hit.
You will constantly be dealing damage to a target with Malady's passive.

Mind you, I'm not saying getting SotD is a bad idea.
It's just a bad idea getting it early, instead of getting an item that does more damage overall, and adds to survivability if you keep attacking.
SotD's active helps against those players that like using exhaust/blind darts to make you miss. The 30 armor pen for 5 secs is a bit useful, but.. it's FIVE seconds.

Also, Malady lets you jungle early.
Malady, and a decent level in SD, will let you live while auto attacking the jungle creeps.

Malady+WC+PAC=Safe Jungling.



Only advantage SotD has over Malady is, you can't miss for FIVE seconds, and the item icon looks a bit more cool. Just a bit though.


Getting a life steal item lets you stay in the lane longer, which lets you get more gold and more exp, which in turn, lets you become stronger faster.

If you want though, you can try to be pro by getting a cloth armor, and 2 hp pots.
Because let's face it, if you can stay in the middle lane till level 12-ish and manage to get 1+ kills, then either you're so ****ing pro with TF that it's nothing to joke about, or the enemy champion just kept auto attacking creeps while you hit him with your weak cardboard cards(happened to me actually, nub Ezreals are everywhere)



Red cards do both of those things, and SD is so easy for harassing. Hit a minion three times, red card, and smack either a champion or a nearby minion for farming+harass. The damage from SD splashes with the red card. Going this route makes it so that I need no mana items at all and I can spam cards all day. If you have a high atkspd, you can build up those SD charges very quickly.

Secondly, going cloth armor +3-5 hp pots will give you all the laning power you need. I find that this lets me lane much easier than a scepter, as the only time I'm ever getting pushed back is against a longer range champ like sivir, in which case the scepter isn't reliable. What I may not have mentioned earlier (can't remember) is that the cloth armor builds into a madred's, which is much more effective for jungling than a scepter and will let you go for buffs/dragon sooner. It also puts TF at 24% reduction compared to 12%. The upgraded Madred's is the real reason to go this way though, as it's the best item I've seen on TF.


I think you're also misunderstanding the use of SotD. It stacks with your SD fourth hit, giving you an extra 100 damage on top of that crazy 4th+card attack. The armor pen is huge, but stopping a jax or other dodgy champ from avoiding your GC is soooo helpful. SotD is a much better item on TF than malady imo, as five seconds is usually all it takes to kill someone.

I think you just have a different playstyle than I do; stacking 3 hits and red carding a champ early on will do very significant damage to the champ and the surrounding minions.


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Hyfe

Senior Member

03-21-2010

I'm with Dr Troll on this one. I think some people are having a hard time adjusting and realizing that the new TF is best played in different way than the old. Maximizing SD effectiveness > wild cards. Synergizes better with a AS/AD style TF build, which seems to be the clearly better build on TF now.


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Lucchinii

Senior Member

03-21-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Troll View Post
Red cards do both of those things, and SD is so easy for harassing. Hit a minion three times, red card, and smack either a champion or a nearby minion for farming+harass. The damage from SD splashes with the red card. Going this route makes it so that I need no mana items at all and I can spam cards all day. If you have a high atkspd, you can build up those SD charges very quickly.

Secondly, going cloth armor +3-5 hp pots will give you all the laning power you need. I find that this lets me lane much easier than a scepter, as the only time I'm ever getting pushed back is against a longer range champ like sivir, in which case the scepter isn't reliable. What I may not have mentioned earlier (can't remember) is that the cloth armor builds into a madred's, which is much more effective for jungling than a scepter and will let you go for buffs/dragon sooner. It also puts TF at 24% reduction compared to 12%. The upgraded Madred's is the real reason to go this way though, as it's the best item I've seen on TF.


I think you're also misunderstanding the use of SotD. It stacks with your SD fourth hit, giving you an extra 100 damage on top of that crazy 4th+card attack. The armor pen is huge, but stopping a jax or other dodgy champ from avoiding your GC is soooo helpful. SotD is a much better item on TF than malady imo, as five seconds is usually all it takes to kill someone.

I think you just have a different playstyle than I do; stacking 3 hits and red carding a champ early on will do very significant damage to the champ and the surrounding minions.
I know the use of SotD, which is why I get it. But I'd rather get a Malady asap.

I would actually probably get SotD first than a Malady should they have a lot of people with exhaust, jax and/or teemo though.

Stacking 3 hits and red carding is useful, but I find it more efficient to use Wild Cards, since you can harass from a safe distance with Wild Cards.

I find just one level in PAC early on useful enough till higher levels.

I agree with you saying Madred's bloodrazor is the best item for TF.
After I build my Malady and Boots, I focus on getting it asap. Focusing on the recurve bow first then the madred razors.
I usually have around 1.9 ASPD after I get the recurve bow for the bloodrazor.

If for some reason you have problems laning with sivir, you can just Wild Card her from a safe distance, since your Wild Card have around the same range as her Boomerang Blade. Also, your regular attacks have longer range than Sivir's, hers is only 400 after the patch. It feels like you're playing a melee champ with her now.



I would actually want to see the way you play though, since I haven't played with too many TFs, and if I have, most of them go for an AP build.


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peyo

Senior Member

03-21-2010

I've been trying a new build and it works great so far.

Vampiric Scepter
Executioner's Calling
Ninja Tabi
Phantom Dancer
Infinity Edge
Bloothirster
Sword of the Divine/Last Whisper

9x Greater Mark of Malice
9x Greater Seal of Evasion
9x Greater Glyph of Focus
3x Greater Quintessence of Malice (using GQ of Focus so far, need to get IPs :P)

Skill build:
1 - Pick a Card
2 - Stacked Deck
3 - Wild Cards

After that max out Stacked Deck, then Wild Cards and then Pick a Card. Of course get Destiny when possible - at 6/11/16lvls

I am maxing Wild Cards, cuz they are BEST harrasment skill, no matter what you say. You'll get 18level quite quickly, especially, if you go mid as you should (old TF shouldn't go mid, but new one pwnz there)


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420 Warrior

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Member

03-21-2010

Honestly, i dont think Malady is good for TF. the life steal isn't really useful since stacked deck is doing magic damage. If you want AS/Lifesteal, you might as well get a starks, since it's an aura AND reduces armor.

You want to abuse stacked deck doing stupid amounts of damage, so stacking attack speed that has an effect per hit is the way to go. Phys Dmg isn't really that great, honestly. Magic Pen runes synergize much better with ALL your skills.


This is what i do.
Boots HP/Mana pot
Recurve bow
Wit's end
Zerk
Phage
Recurve
Madreds
Triforce
Phantom Dancer

You can buy a Sword of the divine if you have a problem with characters that can dodge. Jax/Teemo/Kat/Ninja Tabi.
You can also buy a last whisper if you have armor stacking champs, or if you want to take out towers.

Level PAC/Stacked Deck. When you hit 1050 gold, port back buy recurve bow, and destiny/goldcard someone. Exhaust if they have a lot of HP. Farm empty lanes. Destiny/Gate to gank when it's up. You want to abuse your farming ability to have that item advantage against champs that don't farm well.
Pushing towers is your priority though. You can just ult out if you feel a gank coming.
Tf is one of the most frustrating champions to play against, because he can literally be anywhere anytime.


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Charmicarmicarmicat

Senior Member

03-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Troll View Post
The damage from SD splashes with the red card.
No it doesn't it only works in the initial target


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santa hobofoot

Senior Member

03-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charmicarmicarmicat View Post
No it doesn't it only works in the initial target
Yeah, if it did splash that would be incredibly cheesy.


I have to say, this thread helped me start playing TF when I had no idea what I was doing. As of now, my item build goes

Boots+2 hp pot -> zerker treads + recurve bow -> SotD + Last Whisper -> Guinsoo/Black Cleaver/Wits End -> Banshee's Veil (sometimes right after SotD if we're having issues with a Ryze or something) -> pretty much whatever since the game is usually over at this point


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WelfareChristmas

Junior Member

03-25-2010

"UNIQUE Active: Your attacks cannot be dodged and you gain 30 Armor Penetration for 5 seconds."

Do I understand exhaust and blind? I was under the impression that causes you to miss not to have your opponent dodge.


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Charmicarmicarmicat

Senior Member

03-25-2010

It doesn't work against blind effects, only dodge effects.

Also, malady is horrible for TF. If you're hellbent on getting lifesteal on him, get sword of the divine and a vamp scepter lol.


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