[Discussion] AP vs AD Ezreal

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waxxdd

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Senior Member

03-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by chumbler View Post
chalice, boots 1, brutalizer, sheen, phage, boots 3
Price: 5802

Mejai's Soulstealer, Sorcerer's Shoes, Lich Bane. Price: 5805

You're right, it's 3 gold cheaper for AD But once I have my items, it's all I need. The rest is just luxury. It's especially luxurious if I can complete Zhonya's Ring, once that happens it's game over.

So let's look at our endgame builds now. I'm going to assume your me, so lets pretend you are confident enough to get a stacking item. Not to be snarky or anything, but I am confident I can keep my stacks.

boots 3, chalice, brutalizer, TF, Rageblade = 9532

My build for him: boots 3, TF, Occult, Cleaver = 9504
Probably would buy chalice, then throw it away at endgame.

Let's look at Dafrekknpope's build now: chalice, boots 3, TF, Brute, Bloodthirster = 10497

That's a lot of farming/player killing. Something I noticed, all AD ezzy's buy a chalice for the mana problems. What's nice about AP, is the mana boost it gives you, no need for the regen items. Well, as long as you get MP/5/lvl seals.


Let's look at my AP build:

Soulstealer, Lich Bane, Sorc Shoes, Ring = 9385

Hey look at that, it's cheaper by 200 gold. I'm sick of people saying AD is more expensive. Fine you want a non stacking item?

Rageblade, Lich, Sorc Shoes, Ring = 10385

Ok, it's a thousand more and would be hard to get all of these in an average game. But if you can keep 10+ stacks on your Soulstealer, it's worth it over the Rageblade. I don't think that's an unrealistic goal. Alright, I'm done arguing my point. If I can't convince you AP > AD, I cannot convince you. How about this, you try one game playing AP and report back to me.

Level order:
1. MS
2. AS
3. EF
4. EF
5. EF
6. TB

from here on out, your priority is: TB > EF > MS > AS

Tell me how well you did, how much more awesome your heals were, the awesome power of Lich bane. In case you didn't understand my item starting build:

Sapphire Crystal + 2 Health pots
Sheen + Sorc Boots
Mejai's Soulstealer
Lich Bane
Zhonya's Ring

Ok, go play.


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WasabiCannon

Senior Member

03-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azing View Post
The biggest problem with AP Ezreal is the fact he burns through mana so fast. AP Ezreal just is way to costly skill wise to be effective. Making it worst is the fact that as AP Ezreal you only have 1 skill that can be effectively used all the time. His E ability is difficult to hit the right target in many situations and in order to hit it can mean putting him in a position that could get him killed, not to mention the mana it uses can drain his pool so quickly.

Right now AD Ezreal is most effect right now primarily due to mana issues. His damage is also less bursty and he can take benefit from his passive. Still even as AD I do believe investing in some AP is beneficial such as items like Rageblade or TF.
I build Ezreal AP and have no mana problems
Early game I have around 20/5 mana regen which lets me spam very much on CDs.

End game I always have the mana to spam in teamfights and then ult when needed.


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KaiTo1520

Member

03-23-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjor View Post
I build Ezreal AP and have no mana problems
Early game I have around 20/5 mana regen which lets me spam very much on CDs.

End game I always have the mana to spam in teamfights and then ult when needed.
I'm an AP too...well,,, i tried dps and hybrid...they're cool...but i find AP the best build...and mana was never a problem(i myself doesn't have any runes concerning mana)

Reasons:
-Can support and damage at the same time...(at max with items = 400-500 heal/damage)
-early game nukes(W,E)
-More useful in situations against multiple enemies...
-very VERY useful in teamfights...(high chance of multikills if ulti is shot at the right angle)
-E if used well,,, can turn a chase around (if you're being chased, just tele in the right distance where you'll still be able to hit the chaser[2 of these will hurt him bad])
-Q is great mid-late game when you have lich...
-Burst has fast animation...E,W,Q combo almost goes out simultaneously
-can hurt tanks even in late games...


well,,, there's a whole bunch of reasons... one thing i know though...he ain't for newbies and people who're used to using OP characters...


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chumbler

Senior Member

03-23-2010

Just to clarify, I don't think I've ever said AP is a bad build. If that's the impression people got, it was not my intention. I still need to do a lot more experimenting with builds to streamline for both AP and AD, but I still stand by what I posted earlier, at the very least in that AD Ezreal has the stronger early game because he doesn't need to wait until lichbane to have a decent Q and can thus harass and farm more effectively. AP Ezreal unquestionably has better late game power, I've never debated that. As I said, I still need to play around with him more before I get a build I'm comfortable with, but I hate the feeling of being comparatively dead weight in the early game using an AP build.

I'm beginning to agree that the chalice or other big mana regen is not really needed, especially since I run mp regen/level runes for all my yellows, so that cuts down costs a good amount. One other note, keep in mind that my conclusions are based on a generally more conservative style of play and solo queues, and lately my games seem like they have had somewhat low death counts on either side (compared to some I've seen) or few team fights (why do I get teams that enter fights one at a time or run the other way when I'm playing a tank and try to initiate?) Since I solo queue I'll clearly have different opinions than someone who regularly plays in a premade.


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Nave222

Senior Member

03-23-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by chumbler View Post
Just to clarify, I don't think I've ever said AP is a bad build. If that's the impression people got, it was not my intention. I still need to do a lot more experimenting with builds to streamline for both AP and AD, but I still stand by what I posted earlier, at the very least in that AD Ezreal has the stronger early game because he doesn't need to wait until lichbane to have a decent Q and can thus harass and farm more effectively. AP Ezreal unquestionably has better late game power, I've never debated that. As I said, I still need to play around with him more before I get a build I'm comfortable with, but I hate the feeling of being comparatively dead weight in the early game using an AP build.

I'm beginning to agree that the chalice or other big mana regen is not really needed, especially since I run mp regen/level runes for all my yellows, so that cuts down costs a good amount. One other note, keep in mind that my conclusions are based on a generally more conservative style of play and solo queues, and lately my games seem like they have had somewhat low death counts on either side (compared to some I've seen) or few team fights (why do I get teams that enter fights one at a time or run the other way when I'm playing a tank and try to initiate?) Since I solo queue I'll clearly have different opinions than someone who regularly plays in a premade.
I tried both AD/AP ezreal AD is where it shines early game AP is where it shines late game is how i noticed it went as you have mentioned

they have their uses and pros and cons

as for your HP problem with AP

try this

meki pendant @ start w/ 2 pots
aim for catalyst -->RoA
guinsoo (guinsoo because it will get you up to 100+ AD and thats all i really need +sheen/lichs dmg imo)
sheen-->lichs
some boot at somepoint
rlyais septor ( at this point you will have 2.2k hp and combined with rlyai 2.9k)

mejah is optional and or zonya for last item

sell meki later in game when you can manage your mana with better items

getting RoA and its passive over timegets you some nice HP a AD erzeal missout on
you can survive for the most part the first strikes of a skirmish as well as a gank on yourself if you are quick to avoid them with a Arcane shift and or flash


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KaiTo1520

Member

03-23-2010

Most of my characters go DPS on me coz that's my style... EZ is the only exception... the difference between dps and AP is the damage dealt in a certain time...dps(good dps) can kill in about 2-4secs...AP on the other hand... can kill on a second or 2 less...taking the squishiness of EZ, every second counts on a fight...AP EZ in early game hits hard(no runes attached)... not to mention that W damages and heals everyone in its path so more than one target can be hit(dps does good damage to one target IF he gets hit by Q)...W,E combo can kill at 2 levels each... for me AP has easier kills at early game... specially when ulti is on...im all dps too,,, but i'll disagree with that on EZ...

Items(for me):
ring = 120 life, 5mana/5secs, 10AP
Boots = 20magic pen
either: Guinsoo/Void (i mostly get void)
Lich
LUXURY ITEMS HERE...ring or ryali is cool...

my burst...R(when ulti is on, either on the side of battle or at the back)E, W, Q...


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Kikhan

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Senior Member

03-24-2010

Lawl Ezreal buff I thought he was fine where he was at so let a little more pwnage begin.


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Kikhan

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Senior Member

03-25-2010

Updated pro's and con's with the generally accepted broad scale opinion's between the 2 builds.


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Anthony Giedos

Senior Member

03-26-2010

I personaly have been having some succes with an ap build. I start with a mana crystal and this works wonders. If u only use Q on champions and than auto atack last hit, i find i dont ever really run out of mana too much. The good thing about ap also is u can just sit at the back in team fights and spam. I sometimes upgrade the crystal to a teir of the goddes if i do this i never run out of mana and the spam of Q stacks it in about 6 mins. I dont really know thou, he is a weird character but i am really enjoying seeing the wako ways everyone is building him.


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KaiTo1520

Member

03-29-2010

LoL.... ok on my opinion,,, based on all the fights using/with/against EZ, he is not that scary to fight against when on dps mode...but against an ap EZ, thats where you gotta be careful...EXTRA careful...coz when his ulti hits... tables will be turned... even the W can hurt everyone in a straight line... ok here it is an example...i was Yi and EZ was chasing me...i have about 500 life left... i used Yi's ulti, then EZ used E and W combo on me(i evaded Q) and i lived.... if it was an AP build i'd be dead...another situation...team fights... everyone is fighting w/ minions around DPS EZ is on the back just spamming Q...some get hit some dont...one of his mates got in trouble...he used W and only heald for 200hp... not much use...then he tried to turn the tables around with ulti... boom... not much damage... AP on the other hand... shot W healed for 400-500... then shot ulti... BOOM!!!!! sent every enemy running back then chase with E, W...

im not against dps... but if you match a good dps EZ with a good ap EZ... dps will get crushed...Burst damage between them is too great...