To Jungle Or not to Jungle

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M2Cipher

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04-29-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aynia View Post
21 in offense is awful beyond a doubt.

No competitively picked jungler would ever need or want to run 21 offense. Or even 21 defense.

21 in utility should be taken whenever possible, it offers the most of all mastery trees.

Flat armor seals are superior over dodge runes. Dodge runes are not only less safe, but more unreliable.

Lee Sin is NOT a good jungler. He excels in a 1v1 lane. He is slow at jungling, and his only strong point is his high sustainability which is out done by Warwick, who offers better jungle control and far more reliable ganks start at six, and even scales better into late game.
Ounce again it depends on the player. I can jungle as fast with lee sin as almost any other jungle. He can also use his q to go through walls on golems even saving 2 - 4 seconds on those corner. He steals buffs counter jungle with Q and dominates if played well. You can base everything you are saying off of watching other videos and such, however I have real times and have done what i am talking about, myself. Counter ward jungle steal everything.........


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Aynia

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04-29-2011

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Originally Posted by M2Cipher View Post
Ounce again it depends on the player. I can jungle as fast with lee sin as almost any other jungle. He can also use his q to go through walls on golems even saving 2 - 4 seconds on those corner. He steals buffs counter jungle with Q and dominates if played well. You can base everything you are saying off of watching other videos and such, however I have real times and have done what i am talking about, myself. Counter ward jungle steal everything.........
I find it hard to believe you'd play at a higher level than I, considering you've got 140 ranked solo queue 5v5 games played and have been trapped in 1300 elo for a while now.


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M2Cipher

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04-29-2011

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Originally Posted by Aynia View Post
I find it hard to believe you'd play at a higher level than I, considering you've got 140 ranked solo queue 5v5 games played and have been trapped in 1300 elo for a while now.
I can play a jungle well . I did send you an invite to prove to you about sion jungle. Not only did i do it faster then 4:00 like you said.... Jungeling the entire jungle in 2:46. Come watch if you want.

Also you are a all of 40 points higher then me in solo at your highest? I am ranked in 3s and 5s premade higher then any of your highs... Your argument of you being a better player based on your solo Q is kinda lol?


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averygreasypizza

Junior Member

04-29-2011

Thanks for this post hopefully it will help some people understand what it means to be a better jungler. It is frustrating at times to have a jungler on your team that believes his job is to sit in the jungle and do little more.


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Dark1Magician

Junior Member

04-29-2011

thanks M2Cipher, but I have a question, when jungling ww I need to get lvl 6 as fast is Greater Quintessence of Wisdom any good?


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M2Cipher

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04-29-2011

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Originally Posted by Dark1Magician View Post
thanks M2Cipher, but I have a question, when jungling ww I need to get lvl 6 as fast is Greater Quintessence of Wisdom any good?
Def not... Just go ahead and get the masteries in utilities. for the 5% that is all you need... That extra you can get from the 6% really makes no diff at all. Going attack speed or anything else is better. If you hitting faster your stealing more life, so you can stay in jungle longer, or harass their jungle. Hope this helps.


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ShallowJam

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Senior Member

04-29-2011

somehow you left out trundle and olaf, probably two of the strongest junglers. both can clear very fast (olaf around 3:45) and have decent health (and health regen) at lvl 4 for ganks.

Agreed, olaf's q is his only slow and if you miss it, that sucks. but you can pick it up again and have basically a 0 sec CD on it. if you know what you're doing, its a perma slow.

trundle has a movespeed enhancer, a slow, AND a terrain block. i dont see how this isnt ganking potential.


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M2Cipher

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04-29-2011

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Originally Posted by ShallowJamm View Post
somehow you left out trundle and olaf, probably two of the strongest junglers. both can clear very fast (olaf around 3:45) and have decent health (and health regen) at lvl 4 for ganks.

Agreed, olaf's q is his only slow and if you miss it, that sucks. but you can pick it up again and have basically a 0 sec CD on it. if you know what you're doing, its a perma slow.

trundle has a movespeed enhancer, a slow, AND a terrain block. i dont see how this isnt ganking potential.
I love trundel as a jungle... I don't like olaf.... hes great to clear jungle, but is terrible at ganks... Which is a big part of the jungles job.

However, if you have lots of cc... I like him as a pic... Good teamwork and more cc with him involved is amazing


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Ludak021

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04-29-2011

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Originally Posted by M2Cipher View Post
Lee sin has a q that closes fast and a slow he can use immediately after. He can also use his ult to punt the target to the laner. Great in team fights as well since the ult can have the potential to hit everyone.

Olaf has a slow that you must land from a distance.. And no other skill that can help gank really. They have to be pushed quite far for. Or hope they are terrible players.

akali is okay at ganking but only a slow. She lanes so well and 1v1s so great, why waste her potential to farm minions and just utterly destroy .
maybe you should take a lot at his http://solomid.net/guides.php?g=550 when talking olaf and jungling...Olaf starts at blue mate After getting the red buff (~2 minutes) he has no need to stun, he slows from distance, caches up and that's that, his attacks slow the enemy. (you build frozen mallet later on) You can hardly escape if you don't have flash or team support. In theory anyways, but look at the videos.

thanks for your tips anyway, appreciated, although Olaf doesn't need att speed runes at all, you can get HP and AR/AR pen runes instead. I am no expert but ARpen is always usefull as is AR. 18 might not be much but +18 from starting cloth and you have 36 early game + your base...jungle at half HP for +50% att speed and not worry too much about enemy jungler with all that armor + you are off tank already...

PS. You could also add the part that in early game ppl in lanes (2 solo lanes and one normal) shouldn't "steal" creeps from your teams jungle since it's junglers only source of exp and gold at that time, and I see people stealing 2 golems and whatnot all the time when they get zoned out or just because they can. It cripples your early jungle and sets you back.
I do ask people politely not to do it, but if they do it anyway I just show them how fast Olaf can farm their lane...Not polite but it's no longer proper team play anyway when someone just ignores you right? Maybe not, dunno, all I know is that I need lantern asap or I might just go and lane farm instead...


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M2Cipher

Member

04-29-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ludak021 View Post
maybe you should take a lot at his http://solomid.net/guides.php?g=550 when talking olaf and jungling...Olaf starts at blue mate After getting the red buff (~2 minutes) he has no need to stun, he slows from distance, caches up and that's that, his attacks slow the enemy. (you build frozen mallet later on) You can hardly escape if you don't have flash or team support. In theory anyways, but look at the videos.

thanks for your tips anyway, appreciated, although Olaf doesn't need att speed runes at all, you can get HP and AR/AR pen runes instead. I am no expert but ARpen is always usefull as is AR. 18 might not be much but +18 from starting cloth and you have 36 early game + your base...jungle at half HP for +50% att speed and not worry too much about enemy jungler with all that armor + you are off tank already...
I agree with all of this . However I still like having a champ that offers good teamwork later if no one else is running hard cc. Solo q, that ends up being the biggest problem. I still go with AS runes though, because you can always just go straight dmg items and never buy attack speed at all. Buying a last whisper fixes all your probs

Also, I don't want to be running around half hp and get caught before im 6 with him.