Why No One Should Ever Buy Crit DMG

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EasymodeX

Senior Member

03-05-2010

Quote:
Armor penetration increases burst? How so?
A player with ArPen will do, say, +40% damage on all attacks when the enemy has 30 armor. This includes the 7% of the time at low levels when you crit.

A player with crit damage will do, say, +15%? on CRITs. This is the 7% of the time at low levels when you crit.

And oh wait, ArPen buffs all your non-crit attacks too.

So yeah, crit damage fails epicly.


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Yana

Senior Member

03-05-2010

Very interesting, thanks for showing that.

I guess it's more a case that armor penetration needs a nerf, and quite a few other runes need a buff.

Infact, the whole rune system is a mess and needs to be standardised from scratch in terms of what they're "worth" in equivilent items and effectiveness.


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ZenithZephyr

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Senior Member

03-05-2010

Yeah they really didn't need to be nerfed, the crit damage runes.


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AutoSponge

Senior Member

03-05-2010

Thanks for the clarification on how armor works.

I was able to create a spreadsheet (my favorite thing to do when avoiding real work and I can't play) that calculates DPS for Ashe.

I determined her optimal build for items, then applied all red + quit runes of varying types, C%, Cdmg, AS, and ArPen. I tested for three levels of play for the target's armor (30, 70 and 200). I figure, early game, mid-game/late squishies, late-game/tanks.

The results are clear. ArPen rules all. For those interested the build turned out like this:

Recurve Bow
Last Whisper
BF Sword
Pickaxe
Agility Cape
Infinity Edge
Recurve Bow
Recurve Bow
(8145 g)
<doesn't include boots or damage mitigation only DPS. Obviously you may not have time for RBow #2, #3)>


Builder Link


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Morzas

Senior Member

03-05-2010

That still isn't burst damage, though. That's sustained damage. Critical Chance and Critical Damage boost your burst damage and make your damage output more unpredictable. Armor Penetration, Attack Speed and Attack Damage boost your sustained damage. Every time you attack, your penetration, attack speed and damage are applied to it, so if you have no critical chance or critical damage, your opponent can know exactly when they need to flee. Critical Chance and Critical Damage aren't always applied -- they give your attacks some unpredictable burst.


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EasymodeX

Senior Member

03-05-2010

Quote:
That still isn't burst damage, though. That's sustained damage. Critical Chance and Critical Damage boost your burst damage and make your damage output more unpredictable.
Base attack is for sustained damage.

Attack speed is for sustained damage.

ArPen is for sustained and burst damage.

Crit rate is for sustained damage (in the form of more frequent bursts).

Crit damage is for burst damage.

ArPen's burst damage improvement > crit damage's burst damage improvement. Note that in the list above, crit damage has nothing else going for it. The end.


Sidenote: Your wish would be correct if crit damage actually added a *lot* of crit damage. It doesn't. Your wish evaporates.


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Psi21

Senior Member

03-05-2010

I found the below thread more informative about the value of crit damage runes.

http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board...ad.php?t=52064

After all armor penetration modifiers can be bought in game (some modify armor penetration greatly such as the last whisper) and after next patch the only crit damage item in the game will be the Infinity Edge.


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EnderA

Senior Member

03-05-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by EasymodeX View Post
Actually, 30 arpen is a (100-70)/70 = 43% damage boost from your original expected damage, when the target has 30 armor.

Looking at it that way makes it more LULZ.

An equivalent amount of crit damage is what, like +10%, only on crits?

So much fail. A full set of crit damage runes on the rune page, to be efficient in terms of raw damage / DPS / stat allocation, needs to be around +50-60% damage imo.

ArPen should give a lesser flat DPS increase than crit damage. A "43%" boost is fine at level 1, due to the fact that that boost will decrease over the duration of the game (at higher armor levels it'll be like +30% damage boost).

Of course, Deceive with a +50% crit damage bonus from runes would be lolfail. But, that's what happens when you stack 78 types of effects at level 1, and back it up with a page full of randomly assorted stat buffs.
At 30 armor, it's 30% bonus damage:

Damage with penetration/Damage without =
(100/100)/(100/130) = 130/100 = 30% bonus.

But yeah, you're right that Armor Penetration is ridiculously better than crit damage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EasymodeX View Post
Base attack is for sustained damage.

Attack speed is for sustained damage.

ArPen is for sustained and burst damage.

Crit rate is for sustained damage (in the form of more frequent bursts).

Crit damage is for burst damage.

ArPen's burst damage improvement > crit damage's burst damage improvement. Note that in the list above, crit damage has nothing else going for it. The end.


Sidenote: Your wish would be correct if crit damage actually added a *lot* of crit damage. It doesn't. Your wish evaporates.
Yup, although Base attack is for both sustained and burst, just like armor pen. Of course, those runes are pretty bad.


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Heero Maki

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Recruiter

03-05-2010

Very nice.Wish I knew this before i bought my crit dmg runes. though i do have both anyways..


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68iOweYou1

Senior Member

03-05-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heero Maki View Post
Very nice.Wish I knew this before i bought my crit dmg runes. though i do have both anyways..
lmao yeh same, it sounds alot better then it actually is