Quote:

**Insanious**:

Nope because your logic is flawed. I take armor pen items, as well as stack crit dmg (i play shaco) so i get stuff like:

+ 50% from IE

+ 0 - 40% from SotO

- +130% from decieve

+ 32.13% crit dmg from runes (and then movement speed quints)

Get a full SotO and BAM your crits do +252.13% dmg ontop of the 200% dmg the crits do...

Having tons of bonuses to Crit Damage just makes Armor Penetration all the more appealing.

Let's redo the math I did this time assuming you have 50% from IE and 130% from decieve:

100 armor:

With 33.45% Crit Damage: 100 * 3.1345 * (100/200) = 156.73 damage

With 29.37 Armor Pen: 100 * 2.8 * (100/170.63) = 164.10 damage

200 armor:

With 33.45% Crit Damage: 100 * 3.1345 * (100/300) = 104.48 damage

With 29.37 Armor Pen: 100 * 2.8 * (100/270.63) = 103.46 damage

Now redo with 50% from IE and 130% from decieve and 40% from SotO:

100 armor:

With 33.45% Crit Damage: 100 * 3.5345 * (100/200) = 176.73

With 29.37 Armor Pen: 100 * 3.2 * (100/170.63) = 187.54

200 armor:

With 33.45% Crit Damage: 100 * 3.5345 * (100/300) = 117.82

With 29.38 Armor Pen: 100 * 3.2 * (100/270.63) = 118.24

Well look at that, now instead of crit damage pulling ahead at 200 armor, armor penetration is better.

Quote:

**Insanious**:

And wait theres more. My other items include things like:

- The brutalizer

- LW

- BC

So say i have 3 stacks on BC thats

- 40% armor

- 61 armor

That means I get the same bonus as your -armor guy for anyone with less than 101 armor.

No, you don't.

Having Last Whisper and Black Cleaver at the same time is a horrible idea. Armor Reduction/Penetration goes in this order:

-Armor Reduction

-Armor % Penetration

-Armor Flat Penetration

So if they had 60 armor and you got the five stacks of the black cleaver, your last whisper is now doing nothing. If they had 100 armor, you're doing damage against them as though they had (100 - 60) * .6 = 24 armor. If they had 100 armor and you're using last whisper + 60 armor penetration, you're doing damage against them as if they had (100 * .6) - 60 = 0 armor. Hence, either you want Armor Reduction + Flat Armor Penetration or % Armor Penetration and Flat Armor Penetration. Not Armor Reduction + % Armor Penetration.

As long as Flat Armor Penetration is less than or equal to the amount of armor they have, it actually becomes *more* effective the more you add. By contrast, Crit Damage simply has linear returns, each part of which makes Armor Penetration that much more effective.

Quote:

**Insanious**:

But wait, there's more!

The more damage I do, the more damage my crit dmg runes do.

at 100 dmg + crit dmg runes = only +32.13

at 400 dmg + crit dmg runes = +128.52 damage

Indeed there is more, just as crit dmg runes scale with damage,

**so do armor penetration runes**.

At 30 armor and 100 dmg:

With 33.45% Crit Damage: 100 * 2.3345 * (100/130) = 179.58 damage

With 29.37 Armor Pen: 100 * 2 * (100/100.63) = 198.75 damage

At 30 armor and 400 dmg:

With 33.45% Crit Damage: 400 * 2.3345 * (100/130) = 718.32 damage

With 29.37 Armor Pen: 400 * 2 * (100/100.63) = 795.00 damage

*Convinced yet?*