[GUIDE] Melee Kassadin - AKA Inyourfaceagainadin, AKA Hashashadin

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Squawl

Senior Member

08-05-2010

played your guide had a tough time with it not sure if its just my play style or what.

i went on to make kass a tank and it was extremely potent. hope this helps ppl looking for unique builds.


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Ebonclaw

Senior Member

08-05-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mello View Post
Why not throw in lichbane instead of trinity, it deals physical damage (correct me if I'm wrong) and thats a nice 80 extra damage everytime you use an abilty. I know you lose out on the health and atk speed/move/crit of trinity, but you can easily make up that health with another item. just curious
Actually, I do, now. The primary problem with Lich Bane, as far as the intent of the original build, was that it rewards you very dramatically for stacking AP, in effect punishing you any time you purchase an item without AP (by withholding extra proc damage you otherwise could gain).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Squawl View Post
played your guide had a tough time with it not sure if its just my play style or what.

i went on to make kass a tank and it was extremely potent. hope this helps ppl looking for unique builds.
I've heard of people having some success with Tankadin in some scenarios - he becomes sort of like a slimmer Cho, with a Blink. Cool idea, not my cup of tea though.

I will now go ahead and at least tag that first post as being outdated..... I'm honestly surprised that I need to, as when I read a guide or something that is more than a month or so old, I always skip to the end to see what people are saying about it -today-, so just assumed people would see me saying "yeah, this is pretty outdated" in a few places here in the last couple pages.


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Galtath

Senior Member

08-05-2010

cant wait till you update the guide, been maining kass lately and been trying lots of different builds

my runes are completely different though. i run:

magic pen:red
Mp5/seal
MagicResist/glyph
and depending which build i feel like going, flat hp if im going hybrid/flat ap if im going ap

works fine for me. but everyone's opinions are different.


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zackattk

Member

08-08-2010

I just tried a slightly modified version, it wasn't too bad, the problem with AD kass is you have to choose the correct time to go in, otherwise everyone just focus fires you because they assume you are AP kass. Instead of focusing on TriForce, i was looking more towards Nashor's as my early item finish, which worked well, but I think it would've been better if I just kept the Stinger and went TriForce then Nashor's. Nonetheless, Nashor's worked really well, I ended up with a pretty good KD and some good assists, but I lost because my team was kinda feeding. Good guide, definitely looking in the right direction for AD kass, just requires careful planning and play.


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Ebonclaw

Senior Member

08-09-2010

Well what I've been doing lately is certainly starting with Nashor's. Unfortunately at this point in the game (Merc's Treads + Nashor's), laning is coming to a close, and people are starting to group up more, and as you said - Kass is one of those 'sore thumb' champs, that people reflexively dump everything they have on.

In almost every game that I play now, when team fights start to break out, Akali, or Xin, or Jax, or Vlad, or Garen, or god -insertchampwhohasafastcloseroris****edhardtokill- comes rushing straight for me. I had an Amumu yesterday that would run straight at me any time he saw me. His entire goal in life was to stun me, and either run in circles around me in the vain hope of just wearing me down, or to trap me for just long enough for others to get there. It's the same thing, game after game, and at the level of competition that I'm in, I find precious few opportunities at this point to beat people about the neck and face with my giant purple.... sword.

Originally my new build started with Nashor's and then Rageblade, which truly is beautiful when you get the chance to make use of it. More and more, people simply force me to go Abyssal after Nashor's so that I can stay alive through the constant barrages of spells that are pointed at me - plus the MR reduction aura is just beautiful for Kass, and his team. Unfortunately, from this point onward you are 100% better off just investing in AP, as if you have any success killing people (and you will, if you're nimble), then they just become even more enraged and focused on killing YOU, so you can forget about melee deliciousness.

The build in the original post (or a variant thereof) is currently probably viable up to ~1300 Elo in the ladders, and gauging by Riot posts on the ranges reached in Normal now, probably closer to 1600 Elo in Normal matches.

But progressing beyond that far, you won't get enough clear gank opportunities to feed yourself to the point of Entire Match Domination Through Brute Force - so in larger fights, you will neither carve people up fast enough, or you will not have the damage output to lifesteal enough to hang around to finish the job.

The worst part is that I can really only 'test' things in Ranked matches, because Kass is a poor counter to Heim in early lane, and is not a counter at all to Vlad. In Normal matches, more often than not one of those two is picked, making it a wasted 40 minutes as far as testing is concerned (when I wrote this guide, I was almost guaranteed to be against Ashe, like 2/3 of all matches).

I still think I will update and clean up the guide when I get a little extra time, I just think that I have found precisely where the Competitive Ceiling of the build lays. I think I'll also type up a new plea to Riot to actually make Kass worthy of the 'Fighter' tag. What does that really mean? He won't succumb to cancer before the experimental new drugs can start to help? What? Sigh.

<3


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SedulousTurtle

Member

08-21-2010

Ebonclaw, your guide serves as a real inspiration; it's good to show that DPS kass can be built somewhat effectively, even if its not the strongest style in the game.

I really enjoy trying to innovate in LOL and I've been trying really hard my last 40 games, at about 1300 ELO, to make a kassadin work that's heavily phys damage late game, since your phys attack abilities seem to scale up strongest then. I've had mixed success, partly because I think its hard to get right, and part because my playstyle is a little too loose causing lots of deaths, which makes things hard for a mediocre farmer like Kass.

The build that I've found works well is going 21 points into offense (helps w/ last hitting and early ganks), getting teleport as a summoner spell, and getting Bilgewater Cutlass as a first core item (after say dorans ring or meki right off the bat). The slow + small nuke it provides lets you effectively gank even though your spells have lower punch, because your autoattacks can make up for it.

I'm trying to transition into a late game where I've taken full advantage of my autoattack capabilities. My hope is to get enough anti-phys to give a little more survivability and to make most of the damage I take magic-based, allowing me to make full use of the passive.

My theory is that tabi + phantom dancer + atma's + some health should do it -- but the game doesn't usually get to that point, and I usually don't see the passive having much effect (there are times when I find myself at 2.0+ attack speed but its like once every 3 games).

Usually I spend most of the game on cutlass + zeal or maybe phantom and maybe a giant's belt. I seem to do well beating down the squishy casters, and I can chase like a mofo, but the DPS doesn't really compare to many (it does feel like a well-played yi/shaco could fulfill most of the same roles, and better).

I'd really like feedback on fine tuning this from anyone else who tries a similar build. I'd also like to figure out a way to squeeze in a team item/summoner spell; it just seems like the build is too tight to skimp on selfish spec'ing. I'll probably make a more in-depth post about it sometime.


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Galtath

Senior Member

09-08-2010

bump now that manamume is out.


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Sokolov22

Junior Member

09-26-2010

Was there ever an updated version of this?


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Ebonclaw

Senior Member

09-28-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sokolov22 View Post
Was there ever an updated version of this?
Like I said, earlier on this page, I was working with Nashor's > Rageblade as the early core items. Very potent, and I'd push for Gunblade after, so you're looking at becoming a full true hybrid with respectable spell damage, and fearsome melee punch.

But as I was saying, I'd almost always be taking so much flak, I would have to grab a Negatron after the Nashor's was complete, to withstand the incredible amount of spells that would be sent at me, and the focus wouldn't stop, pushing me towards an almost entirely AP build in 80%+ of all matches at 1400+ Solo 5v5 Rating.

I haven't tried Manamune yet with him, I think I'll go do that right now. Seeing a lot less of Vlad mid finally, though I've no idea how well Kass will fare against a remotely competent MF. Let's find out!

Honestly, I have to say that a large part of Melee Kass' decreasing relevance over time has at least as much to do with the new champs that have been released, as my own increasing Elo. With a little lifesteal, I used to tear up tanks just fine with Kass, but Garen and Morde seem to like to just crush him. But, let me see if maybe Manamune is the missing key to the build (it could allow to forgo early IAS to regain mana, which would really change the build a lot - though they nerfed the bonus damage, so who knows!).


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DrDragun

Senior Member

09-28-2010

Manamune was made for him. Manamune and Nashors/Rageblade are pretty fearsome on him. I don't like Sheen/Lichbane because the proc pushes you back toward a more pure build. Honestly the proc should be flat damage or scale with both AD/AP.

The problem with the melee build is the seeming need to fit a survival item in there somewhere. When I do AP build, I generally Riftwalk on top of foes and immediately start running backwards, throwing a Q on any CC threat enemy and fanning out E behind me. When I am standing up and actually fighting in the crowd, I get torn down too fast so I'm always delaying my build 1100 to get a belt or something early which hurts the damage output a lot.