what makes ryze different from renekton and irelia?

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besmurchfreely

Senior Member

04-14-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by baysidebLue View Post
you missed the point completely. let's say you're playing annie, so you get to counter ryze by building MR and armor pen? you're a caster, where is your damage now? meanwhile, ryze gets to build anything with mana while becoming tanky (naturally countering your damage) and still getting damage in the process.

like others have said though, it only becomes a problem late into the game, but the design is still pretty bad
well comparing ryze to annie is bound to make annie look bad, as she is apparently lagging behind the power creep curve a bit, and in need of buffs.


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WAHT I TYPE HERE

Senior Member

04-14-2011

Ryze is OP!


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kthnxbai

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Recruiter

04-14-2011

ryze would be fine if they took 100-150 range from all of his spells. they currently have way too high cast ranges... (600+... really??)


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Kaoculus

Senior Member

04-14-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nephwrack View Post
I don't get why people don't understand this.

Ryze is countered by MR more than nearly any other caster - in order to build Mpen items, he has to trade off survivability/damage items. You want to build a Void Staff? Cool! Problem is, that wastes the slot that could have been a FoN or RoA for more mana(read: actual damage) and/or survivability. His usual 'core' builds don't even seem to include real mpen items. I wouldn't mind seeing a bit of a nerf to the CD of his root and a very small (like .01) mana ratio on his E; if he does get just-nerfed that's cool, but seeing people wanting him nerfed because they still don't understand how he even -works- grates on my sensibilities. It's like complaining about X being OP because you just HAD to go berserker greaves instead of merc treads and let the AP carry with a root run you over, or refusing to build ANY armor against a team of five AD carries. The difference is that Ryze is even more heavily countered by MR than those five AD carries would be by you building a chainmail vest, because he can't even counter your counter without sacrificing the damage/survivability that supposedly make him OP in the first place.

edit: that said, I do like an abyssal scepter on him every so often for the combination of mpen and MR if he needs the latter especially that game, but that's neither here nor there. Abyssal Scepter is just one of my favorite items given the excellent combination of offensive and defensive stats.
FIrst off, who gets FON on ryze? wtf? All ryze players go void staff at the end of their build guaranteed. Check all relevant ryze players, after banshees and frozen heart and tear, almost always is a void staff. Your logic is also invalid because it'd mean that all casters are trash. Picking up defensive items most of the times is trash for casters unless they are farmed or have made decent progress with their builds. Imagine a caster rushing banshees. Useless for probably the rest of the game. There is no "bad" trade off for ryze. Void staff might give you that little AP that is slightly worthless, but for the amount of damage you do plus the tankiness you have, it's definitely worth it


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Kaoculus

Senior Member

04-14-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by besmurchfreely View Post
well comparing ryze to annie is bound to make annie look bad, as she is apparently lagging behind the power creep curve a bit, and in need of buffs.
Annie is the "standard" caster. If you're that much stronger than her, riot's doing something wrong.

plus, i'd hardly classify annie as the same role as ryze. i'd say more tanky sustained burst =P


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JungTimeLord

Senior Member

04-14-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoculus View Post
what makes ryze different from renekton and irelia?
Auto attacks that don't tickle.


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JungTimeLord

Senior Member

04-14-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoculus View Post
Annie is the "standard" caster. If you're that much stronger than her, riot's doing something wrong.
Except Annie is now considered weak and rarely played.


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besmurchfreely

Senior Member

04-14-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoculus View Post
Annie is the "standard" caster. If you're that much stronger than her, riot's doing something wrong.

plus, i'd hardly classify annie as the same role as ryze. i'd say more tanky sustained burst =P
the original thread was closed

but the quote is here

http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board...nd+power+creep

morello says "Annie could use some quality-of-life buffs to keep up with a little of the power creep"

this was yesterday.

So annie is probably not a good yardstick with which to measure any longer, as she is potentially considered to be UnderPowered by morello.


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MisterYi of Wuju

Senior Member

04-14-2011

ok annie is considered UP. That doesn't mean ryze isn't OP.

ryze very OP. great scaling + tanky + root + spam is OP. Only problem I see is no escape, but that isn't a big one since he can just tank it and kill.


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konfetarius

Senior Member

04-14-2011

Quote:
ryze would be fine if they took 100-150 range from all of his spells. they currently have way too high cast ranges... (600+... really??)
So, he would go back to having the exact same problem as the pre-change Ryze, where he had had to walk into targeting reticule of the entire enemy team to do anything other than Spell Flux. Except without his old burst. Note, many people built him Glacial Shroud or Zhonaya for armor, Banshee Veil for MRes/HP/Mana, Rod of Ages for HP/Mana; so his default "tanky" build isn't that much tankier than what most good Ryze player built back then.