Alistar Nerfs not mentioned, whats going on Riot?

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Judah the Lion

Senior Member

02-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicosharp View Post
Also, for how much they have 'cleaned up', and 'worked on' headbutt its animation and its effect... it is the most wonky skill in the game. Singed can fling me while I try to headbutt him, and cancel my damage? wtf? If I hit someone and they move down suddenly they sometimes fly the the direction I came from???? WTF? if I headbutt someone head on sometimes they go off to the side? This is just silly.
That's a good point actually.

If you move around while the animation finishes, you'll lunge and float all over the place too. It just looks bad.

I just think it'd be nice if Riot would shoot straight with the Ali players and tell us if Head-butt's reanimation was an inadvertent nerf to something else or not. That's what I'm not so happy about.


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nicosharp

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Senior Member

02-25-2010

ya, i mean I dont know anyone that even maxes this skill much anymore if not last, as it just fails in a lot of ways, and can only work on enemy champions. Its great in the game of LOL chess, but boy did it suffer through some funky patches that made it seem screwy, and the fact that it hinders the worst farming champion in the game from farming if you dont max pulv first, most people negilect it as a valuable skill to put more than 1 point in.


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Judah the Lion

Senior Member

02-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicosharp View Post
ya, i mean I dont know anyone that even maxes this skill much anymore if not last, as it just fails in a lot of ways, and can only work on enemy champions. Its great in the game of LOL chess, but boy did it suffer through some funky patches that made it seem screwy, and the fact that it hinders the worst farming champion in the game from farming if you dont max pulv first, most people negilect it as a valuable skill to put more than 1 point in.
I'll be updating my combo guide here: https://www.leagueoflegends.com/boar...t=57014&page=3 in accordance to the following.

So, after a combo test run with Alistar, I've come to the conclusion that the only two viable combos are his BnB and Mini-force. Nothing else, no proc. combos are worth the Sheen investment now, and Alistar has been lowered in the overall competitive tier bracket because of this.

I cannot suggest using Ali at this point because he lacks potential and usefulness to a team beyond a CC/minor heal bot.

Sorry guys.


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vileguy

Senior Member

02-26-2010

I don't like the sheen/infinity nerf, especially the infinity, but I don't think it's a huge deal to alistar, he's a bad farmer period, this isn't a huge deal.

Flash cooldown nerf is fine. Flash is amazingly powerful, for it to be up every other fight is too much.

Not sure what chain pulverize to headbut is so no comment.

I don't think you should be able to punch someone as they fly away from your headbutt, hit them before.

I don't have a problem with stealth tweaks, mostly because they're probably not intentional. Most quality developers publish a lot of their changes because some of the community really appreciates it, and it's not in anyone's interest to try to sneak changes in because they will be discovered. The reason for a stealth tweak is probably either 1. it was overlooked or forgotten or 2. it was considered too minor to write in.


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Archeus

Junior Member

02-26-2010

I don't play Alistar as a killing machine, I'm there to support my teammates. I find myself only using Sheen as my third/fourth item. His stun duration I haven't really noticed that much of a difference and I mainly use flash as a get away too rather than setting myself up for a knockback that might not be beneficial.

Someone saying his heal is only good with innervating lock needs to pick up an archangels staff. The AP coefficient isn't amazing but when you get your heals up to 125+, firing it off a lot it really does make a nice difference. Not to mentioned his stun and headbutt have a 1-1 AP ratio. I see his melee as being pretty useless so I avoid focus on increasing that first.


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nicosharp

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Senior Member

02-26-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Judah the Lion View Post
I'll be updating my combo guide here: https://www.leagueoflegends.com/boar...t=57014&page=3 in accordance to the following.

So, after a combo test run with Alistar, I've come to the conclusion that the only two viable combos are his BnB and Mini-force. Nothing else, no proc. combos are worth the Sheen investment now, and Alistar has been lowered in the overall competitive tier bracket because of this.

I cannot suggest using Ali at this point because he lacks potential and usefulness to a team beyond a CC/minor heal bot.

Sorry guys.
Well, I am not sure Alistar dropped a tier, because despite the procs and the headbutt+pulv combo he was top tier. The only thing that may drop him a tier is the continual nerfs to flash and pulv. Also if the quality of how his skills interact, like pulverizes missing if you are stunned at the same time, when they should hit, and go on cooldown, and the glitches we mentioned above concerning headbutt.

I think Alistar is still very strong, but these 'ghost' nerfs will definitely hinder his gameplay variability, and the community interest in playing him for 'fun' due to his horrible ability to get gold for items.


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Judah the Lion

Senior Member

02-27-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicosharp View Post
Well, I am not sure Alistar dropped a tier, because despite the procs and the headbutt+pulv combo he was top tier. The only thing that may drop him a tier is the continual nerfs to flash and pulv. Also if the quality of how his skills interact, like pulverizes missing if you are stunned at the same time, when they should hit, and go on cooldown, and the glitches we mentioned above concerning headbutt.

I think Alistar is still very strong, but these 'ghost' nerfs will definitely hinder his gameplay variability, and the community interest in playing him for 'fun' due to his horrible ability to get gold for items.
Believe it or not, his interaction with Sheen and the once-was Mini-force were some of the prime things in higher ELO games that made him such a pushing and initiating asset, but even though the Sheen nerf was small, Ali's attack speed is so slow that he really took a hard hit in the damage dept, not even bringing his lost combos into the equation.

That said, yeah, tearing his stun up and making half of his sequences inoperable made me play him maybe once out of every 9 games I play a tank now; to me, it's just not very fun when you can so blatantly feel and see a champ's skill ceiling, when he once had many more options at his disposal.

I'm really liking Singed in place of Ali now though, so I'm not too butthurt over it!


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Archbob

Senior Member

02-27-2010

I still play Alistar although Rammus may be a better tank now though.

I just stack sunfire capes and a force of nature on him.

I usually get get boots, then get a sunfire cape(which solves some farming issues), then depending on the team composition I will get Either force of nature or another sunfire cape.

The thing about Alistar is that sunfire gives both HP and Armor which helps him tank, all you need is a magic resist item and at level 16, you basically have a hero that can't die for 10 seconds while doing AOE damage with sunfire.

If you having trouble farming, you can always get Madreds razors with him, then you don't need to last hit so much.


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Gavar

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Junior Member

02-27-2010

A potential fix could be to return his animations to pre-patch (allowing head-butt > pulverize and auto attacks mid stun) , then change his passive to act like sheen, only adding 20% of total damage (not base) to next hit. This would let sheen be viable, and allow it to not be OP for the other champs who typically use it. It would also increase his damage output significantly so he can be a moderate threat.


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nicosharp

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Senior Member

02-27-2010

i like that suggestion.