[Essay] Snowballing - Why DotA had it right and LoL is still learning

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Lynxion

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Senior Member

02-25-2010

I do not agree.


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Charmicarmicarmicat

Senior Member

02-25-2010

Be specific


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Lynxion

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Senior Member

02-25-2010

I don't like less exp for killing. How are people who run around ganking ( Shaco, etc ) suppose to get exp? Farming like everyone else?


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Lynxion

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Senior Member

02-25-2010

It's almost been 13 hours and you haven't answered, I win.


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Phi Trigger

Senior Member

02-26-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zileas View Post
Our philosophy on this issue is that individual snowballing is good, and team snowballing is bad. Right now, team snowballing occurs too much -- one super carry twitch is a lot easier to handle than 5 guys who are 3 levels higher than each of you.

We are going to make some experience table tweaks to reduce team snowballing without hurting individual snowballing much. We are also going to make a new 3 lane map that is larger, has less cross-map connectivity (so that there is higher cost to 5 man roam, and less shutdown of the farming/laning phase via the first tower being down), etc.

We probably will nerf flash.

We wont be nerfing snowball items. Emotional highs from the game you super carried make this genre sticky. We removed it too much in the beta, and it cost us. Sorry, but being super carry annie or super carry corki once in a while gets a player through the 8 defeat in a row streak they hit the next day.

I'm on the fence about early gold for kills. It's been something we have been talking about, for the reason you cite. OF course, an early kill is also harder than a late kill.
I see what you are trying to accomplish, but it seems like you went about it the wrong way with the snowball items. Making items to counteract the inevitable effects of a system that punishes success (perpetually gravitating to 50% win) is flawed. It's flawed especially because those same items are *the absolute worst items to buy* the next day, when they might be losing 8 games in a row, if they desired at least 1 win out of those 8 games. The problem here is that a player will probably have a soulstealer before they realize how obscenely imbalanced the teams are, and by then the game will be lost regardless of how good they are (a good team will always focus out a player with a build-up item first). So by adding items into the game like this you are just training players to make bad decisions with artificial positive reinforcement in the form of newb bashing.


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Hamburglin

Senior Member

02-26-2010

I am also very sick of games that are determined within the first 10 minutes, I'd say that is about 25% of the games. Its horrible, and for some reason surrendering was changed from 15 minutes to 25 minutes.... what the ****?


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Phi Trigger

Senior Member

02-26-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZGBaddy View Post
Very well written article, but one question:

Why should we allow comebacks?

It's part of the game to be cautious during the first minutes. Chances are, if you got first blood and the rest of your team got some kills, your team is simply better and deserve to win.
Why shouldn't there be comebacks? The game should reward whoever played the best throughout the game, not who played the best at the start (or farmed a newb). Also the game should reward diverse strategies equally, rather than simply killing enemy heroes as the primary method to win. If all players were of equal skill, then it might work better that way, but when we have random teams and inevitably inferior players in the game we can't just make the game screwed by a feeder giving away the primary victory condition.


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Phi Trigger

Senior Member

02-26-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamburglin View Post
I am also very sick of games that are determined within the first 10 minutes, I'd say that is about 25% of the games. Its horrible, and for some reason surrendering was changed from 15 minutes to 25 minutes.... what the ****?
Total bandaid solution that needs an authentic solution instead.