**Comments in Bold**

Quote:

**redrobin3**:

Thornmail is proven to shut down physicals hardcore but now there's math that shows just how much it shuts physicals down.

Formula:

(1-A/A+100)*D*LS=D*(.3*(1-MR/MR+100)

**A/A=1 also MR/MR=1... So... what this is telling me (1-1+100)*D*LS=D*(1-1+100)**

you are also telling me...

D*LS=D which i am fairly certain is incorrect

Also i'm no even sure what this first formula is trying to proove
Legend:

- A=opponent armor
- D=Your damage
- LS=Your lifesteal
- MR=Your magic resist

How to use:

Simply add in your opponents armor your magic resist and your current damage and you will see how much lifesteal u need to break even on your own damage from thornmail.

Conclusion:

Doing some quick and easy numbers 25% armor requires 40% lifesteal to penetrate 50% armor requires 60% alright this seems reasonable sort of now watch this 75% requires 120%. This 75% is the tank. This means that unless u manage to get 120% lifesteal u can't ever touch the tank EVER. If you do you will never win. Now applying some fancy additions you can further determine the extent of the damage if you fall short of meeting the expected LS.(yes this is just shifting around the original formula to show what numbers are left)

**The section above is complete bull**

As long as you have 30%+ life steal you can survive attacking a tank with thornmail with absolutely no repercussions also it's not too hard for an AD crit carry to tear through a tank
Second formula:

D*(.3*(1-MR/MR+100)-(1-A/A+100)*D*LS = Damage taken

**the above formula is plain wrong.**

(D*LS) - (D*.3* [1-MR]) = Damage taken or life gained from attacking a champ with Thornmail

where 1-MR is the the amount of damage not blocked by MR assuming we are looking at MR as a percentage. so if your MR is 30% you take 70% of the damage that would be done to you by the thornmail, however you gain life from lifesteal at the same time and that is the full percentage.

So far i have no idea where you learn how to do math
How to use:

plug in all the numbers and see what you get.

Note: I am not calling thornmail OP but I am saying it's too good a shut down on physicals.Also note that getting 5 fully charged Blood Thirsters will cause you to actually fight back against a rammus to some extent so might want to try that out when the game has lasted 2 hours.

edit: Apparently pressing enter instantly posts your topic and i can't change the name back to thornmail after accidentally deleting the T ><

Here is a VERY GOOD AD build that involves LS

AS boots

IE

PD

Executioners calling

Bloodthirster

Banshee's vale

you're have 38% LS 70% crit chance 250% crit damage and 140-180 AD and 80% increased AS

Assuming your AD carry has 100 base AD and .9 base AS at lvl 18 you'll be doing

about 200 damage per hit (70% of the time) at a rate of 1.6 attacks per second, and that's assuming that the enemy has 70% armor and you have no armor pen.

With 5 max blood thirsters under the same scenario you'll be doing about the same amount of DPS and have 100% LS however that's assuming that they are MAXed. However you will have almost no survivability have less speed and the other build will be doing far more damage if you happen to have a higher base AD than assumed (which is normally the case).

also, if you're just attacking a tank with thornmail and you have NO MR the thornmail won't kill you by it's self unless the tank has 3x the amount of HP you have.