Do %pen items amplify -reduction percentages?

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Eberzelius

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Recruiter

02-06-2010

The max reduction, with fiddle+abyssal is 36, and everybody get more than that by the start. The only reason I can see, is that Riot will probably implement a way to negate the enemy's MR.


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Drake Tseng

Senior Member

02-06-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fbsunny View Post
No, but you are also doing your maths wrong. Neither flat penetration nor %pen can make an enemies MR go negative, nor will they decrease the MR of an enemy who is already negative.

Abyssal Scepter reduces MR by 20. Sorc shoes and guise each penetrate 20. Meaning if you have all 3 of these items.
An enemy with <20 MR will go negative
An enemy with 20<x<60 will go to 0
An enemy with >60 will have their MR-60

The %pen from void staff is applied after the -MR of abyssal, and before the flat penetration of Guise/sorc shoes. With all 4 of these items the following would happen
An enemy with <20 MR will go negative
An enemy with 20<x<87 will go to 0
An enemy with >87 will have their (MR-20)*.6-40 which will be >0

And for further clarity on this subject, %pens are additive not multiplicative, so with archaic knowledge it would be 55% penetration and the table would look like this.
An enemy with <20 MR will go negative
An enemy with 20<x<109 will go to 0
An enemy with >109 will have their (MR-20)*.45-40 which will be >0

In general you only want the abyssal scepter if you or a teamate has other -MR skills (Fiddle, Amumu, Ryze and probably some I am forgetting), otherwise flat penetration or % penetration is cheaper/more effective.
Please copy, new thread, paste, and sticky please.


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Poruku

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Senior Member

02-06-2010

Fbsunny has is explained. If you didn't quite get it, I have smore explanation in my guide, just skip the fiddle stuff.
http://leaguecraft.com/strategies/gu...er+Go+Negative!
If you skip to the magic penetration and reduction section, it explains everything there, rather clearly.


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Avloren

Senior Member

02-06-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake Tseng View Post
Please copy, new thread, paste, and sticky please.
.. Already been done. Read http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board...ead.php?t=3287, which is stickied at the top of this very forum, all your MR/armor reduction questions and more are answered there.

Also, ability to go below 0 isn't the only difference between reduction and penetration. Reduction has two benefits; it can reduce below 0 (theoretically, this rarely happens) and more importantly it applies to everyone attacking the target, not just you. Penetration only works for you, and can't reduce below 0, but since flat penetration applies after percent, flat penetration stacks with percent much better than reduction does.

Say, for example, your enemy has 100 MR and you have 55% penetration (mastery and item). This means they effectively have 100*.45 = 45 MR against you, and 100 MR against everyone else. If you add 20 MR penetration, they now have 100*.45-20 = 25 MR against you, and still 100 against everyone else. If you instead add 20 MR reduction, they have (100-20)*.45 = 36 MR against you, and 80 MR against everyone else (unless they, too have penetration/reduction items). So 20 MR penetration is -20 no matter how much percent you have, until they hit 0, at which point it has no effect. Reduction is less effective when you have percent penetration, in this case 20 reduction only gives you effectively -9 MR (45 down to 36), but it does help all your teammates as well. Practically speaking the reduction below 0 thing will rarely happen and not by a significant amount.


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