Thoughts on Nidalee (Lite guide, focusing mainly on items)

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Lord GiantR

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Senior Member

01-29-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpspindel View Post
Charm: The problem with a Frozen heart is that you pay a lot of money for 500 mana, something that she doesn't really benefit from, same goes with Glacial. Rylai is too big of an item to build, I think, even though the effects are good.

She can easily sneak in one auto-attack, be it after a heal or a swipe- if nothing else high AS helps with it. Thers's always room for at least one hit no matter what, especially when you consider the benefit. I agree on the merc boots... most of the time anyway, it depends a lot on matchup. I'm surprised not more people buy them though because ****, they are easily one of the best items in the game! Cheap too!

I know that AP affects the abilities in cougar form too, I never said they didn't! What I am saying though is that the bonuses are so small from the AP that you'll make a bigger difference by focusing more on CDR and less on AP- a mix of both is best for all purposes.

Empyron: Sheen is a good item on her, and that is a viable starting build... but by getting berzerker greaves you ignore what makes her good. She's not about AS or auto-attack at all, majority of her damage comes from the bursts in cougar form. The bloodthirster is a ****ty item. You pay a lot and get almost no bonuses- the passive one only works for kills, and they are ALL lost upon death. Even if you do get 5 kills in a row without dying, all you've ended up with is 5 more physical damage and 5% more lifesteal- something she barely benefits from anyhow.

Khaotic: Please :P Feedback on the OP is what I want, not just your own build!

Also bloodthirster gets stacks from minion kills


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Cpspindel

Member

01-29-2010

Charm: What's the motivation behind it? All that mana is a waste!

GiantR: Oh ****, it does? Then it's not as worthless as I assumed it was!


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Charmicarmicarmicat

Senior Member

01-29-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpspindel View Post
Charm: What's the motivation behind it? All that mana is a waste!

GiantR: Oh ****, it does? Then it's not as worthless as I assumed it was!
Not entirely. Good nidalee's constantly formswitch to use abilities, this requires mana. SHe's certainly not the most mana intensive hero, but it's not wasted.

CDR with armor is the core reason though. Nid needs survivability.


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dripskydrip

Senior Member

01-29-2010

Someone of you perhaps got the idea what does exactly hotshot'sGG build look like? Or is it mythical? ;-) Would help a lot Nidalee players, who often rush TF + Bloodthirster. And that does not work in higher elo.


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Charmicarmicarmicat

Senior Member

01-29-2010

from what i've seen from streams and playing with him, he rushes frozen heart, although i've seen him get tri force first after being like 8-1.

Not sure of the rest..


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AFKray

Senior Member

01-29-2010

Wow, I just spent so long writing what I look back and realize was a massive guide on Nidalee and then my comp froze. So here is the tiny version:

I play Nidalee as my main and run in the top-ELO bracket. I've seen Hotshot and flankd's Nidalee plenty of times and they both have very good ways to build her. However, I tend to build her completely differently with an equal degree of success. The items basically run as follows:

Sheen
Mercs
Rylai's
Atma's
:Finish Trinity:
Rageblade
Abyssal Septer/GA/Token defensive item.

If i am doing very well early, I will get a Mejai's in between my Rylai's and Atma's.


Basically, the debate on Nidalee thus far is the AP vs AD debate. However, what people don't seem to get is that fact this debate is so hot means that she can do both, VERY well. So, I made a build to utilize both ways to an equally effective caliber. Rushing IE as a 3rd item for a strong AD build grants you that 80 damage and 30% crit + crit damage. Since you aren't going to be crit happy, the crit damage really shows itself during a heavy Takedown crit, which in order to get those big numbers the target has to be close to death which most of the time it would take a lesser number to deal the killing blow. The passive aside, I'm looking at the straight damage and Crit. Atma's gives you more than half that crit + equally the same damage (with my build, as your HP will be high enough to yield around a 60 or 70 + AD from Atmas) but for significantly less. On top of that, I get the much needed armor for your fragile cat form. Rylai's compliments Atma's by increasing its damage, as well as giving me a larger heal, insane initiator/finsher (small increases of AP still scale extremely well with Jav due to its 250% multiplier), and hefty pounce damage, which is your most used cat skill. Swipe does benefit, but not that much to really make a difference. Also, did I mention it eliminates Nidalee's largest pitfall, which is her lack of a snare. This adds the slow to ALL of the cat form abilities + Jav and Traps.

Basically the focus is survival. The damage you can output comes and stays the same for the most part from your cougar form. The key to playing the beast that is Nidalee, comes with your ability to stay alive during the first half of a team engagement. You basically play as a tag-team powerhouse partner who needs heroes at low hp to get tagged in. Luckily, early AP boosted Jav's help this a lot. Once the ults have been busted out, you step in to deal insane amounts of damage really, really fast. It is getting to this point where you see most Nid's fall by the wayside. Anyway, before you want to hate, try it out. Make sure you get to your Atma's + Rylai's before you judge and also take note that I normally reach both of these items by around mid game.

Also, to bring this back to the OP, I don't normally go CD reduction simply because With a Sheen, I can solo the golem with ease, and I often have priority to getting it as well. (Spamming heals + Javelins = the best pre-initiator to teamfights.) This also puts my CD's under the threshold in which I can go Kitty attacks -> switch and have my next heal off its cooldown.


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Cpspindel

Member

01-29-2010

Edit: I will try that build out, thanks for motivating it! I'll see how it works- I'm not very big on the jungling part, I usually just forget about it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charmicarmicarmicat View Post
Not entirely. Good nidalee's constantly formswitch to use abilities, this requires mana. SHe's certainly not the most mana intensive hero, but it's not wasted.

CDR with armor is the core reason though. Nid needs survivability.
None of her form abilities cost mana, neither does the transformation- she doesn't really consume more mana then any other hero. All that mana is overkill. CDR, Armor and Mana can be had through other means, less expensive and more efficient.


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Carthias

Senior Member

01-29-2010

I personally love doing a hybrid nidalee. Rush a trinity force then pick up guardians, then either pick up a bloodthirster or if you are getting focused heavily grab a thornmail/banshees veil and warmogs. I run cleanse and exhaust and getting away after being focus fired with barley any hp is amazing. I find that going either pure AP or AD you tend to get focused a lot and die within 5 seconds of a teamfight


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AFKray

Senior Member

01-29-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carthias View Post
I personally love doing a hybrid nidalee. Rush a trinity force then pick up guardians, then either pick up a bloodthirster or if you are getting focused heavily grab a thornmail/banshees veil and warmogs. I run cleanse and exhaust and getting away after being focus fired with barley any hp is amazing. I find that going either pure AP or AD you tend to get focused a lot and die within 5 seconds of a teamfight
Exactly, it's like being a druid in WoW. Once you see that, her true potential is unleashed!


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SushiRolI

Member

01-29-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by dripskydrip View Post
Someone of you perhaps got the idea what does exactly hotshot'sGG build look like? Or is it mythical? ;-) Would help a lot Nidalee players, who often rush TF + Bloodthirster. And that does not work in higher elo.
ive watched him livestream a few times, when i saw him hed go with ghost/cleanse
Dorans ring+ hp pot and start with trap and spam them in every vulnerable spot. then max heal then spear. Then it seems his first trip back is usually for merc treads and the armor components of frozen heart. Though i guess it depends on when he needs to go back on what he gets. If hes doing really well it seems he gets trinity force over frozen heart but i havent seen him stream any matches of that so i wouldnt know.

Try w/e build though, there are many builds you can do to be successful. The main reason he does so well is how he manages cougar form to fight/escape and healing.