Maokai Item discussion

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KillerStriker

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Member

02-19-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Covenant View Post
So I'd never build him as a tank, but I'd hesitate to field him at all if my team needed some AP burst damage. He doesn't do any role well enough to beat out the competition. He can't tank better than Shen, Rammus, Malphite, Amumu, Udyr, Nasus... etc. And he's no Annie, Kassadin, Malzahar, Morgana... etc. So what's he do that makes him worth picking in a serious game? I think that's what he needs.

I plan to continue playing him, I just don't want to lie to my team and say it's the best choice I could make.
I think Maokai's on par with Morgana. Which maybe isn't helping his case any. . .


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Lumovanis

Senior Member

02-19-2011

I have found success in cooldown stacking. Now this normally wouldn't work because of his mana, but bear with;

Runes:

Flat Armor marks (+8.2 armor, like starting with a doran's shield almost)
Scaling MP5 seals (+11 MP5 @ 18, every little bit helps in his case)
Flat Magic Resist glyphs (+13 MR, helps a bit with early game)
Flat Mana quints (+113 mana, helps a bunch early and mid game)

Masteries:

Cripple 1/1
Resistance 3/3
Hardiness 3/3
Strength of Spirit 3/3
Harden Skin 3/3
Veteran's Scars 4/4
Perseverance 3/3
Good Hands 1/3
Awareness 4/4
Meditation 3/3
Insight 1/1
Quickness 1/3

Most of it is self explanatory, the 1 random rank in quickness seems better than anywhere else for the 1 extra rank. Insight and cripple add more utility to the two summoner spells I bring.

Spells:

In case you couldn't guess;

Clarity (relieves a lot of your early and mid game mana problems, and later, allows you to keep allies topped off during a team fight)

Exhaust (helps keep enemies in your ult, and makes them prime targets for your allies, no reason not to bring it, as your main role in fights is to disable and cause a lot of problems for the other team)

Items:

Starting: Doran's Ring (Combined with the runes/masteries I've stated, you end up with quite a bit of early game survivability. On top of that, the extra AP and mana regen here will make it easier to farm and harass early game with saplings)

1.) Boots of Speed

2.) Catalyst of the Phoenix

3.) Boots of Speed --> Ionian Boots of Lucidity

4.) Catalyst of the Phoenix --> Rod of Ages

5.) Soul Shroud (starting with Kindle Gem)

6.) Situational Tank Item (I prefer frozen heart even though a lot of the cooldown is wasted, simply because late game you will be an anchor for your team during fights, and the debuff can be useful, and mana of course is always helpful. However, build a veil or FoN if that's what your team needs.)

7.) Trade Doran's Ring for Situational Tank Item (I like to grab aegis here personally, as it adds to your anchor status, and only makes maelstrom better. Though sunfire cape or abyssal scepter could also work)

With this build you should be able to pretty much spam all of your abilities most of the time, running straight into the middle of fights to root melee out of reach of your squishies, or simply use it to nail runners. Despite arcane smash being lackluster, it still has its uses in the middle of a teamfight, I love using it to knock melee off of DPS for a second, a lot of times it's enough. Also, with your mana and cooldowns with this build, you should be able to keep Maelstrom up during any teamfight, even dropping it and reusing it as the battle moves. Your passive will be going off a lot during fights, and with your health, you should be smacking someone every time it's up.

The RoA and Doran's may strike people as odd, but playing him like a mage early game and maxing sapling to farm/harass/possibly get kills leads to a much better late game from I've noticed. Honestly I like him, he makes a great anchor that can also cover his squishy dps pretty well with his ult and disable. I think arcane smash needs some love and sapling could use a debuff or something to keep it useful late game, but I'm liking him so far.


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Ahrimal

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Senior Member

02-19-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerStriker View Post
I think Maokai's on par with Morgana. Which maybe isn't helping his case any. . .
Morgana is about 3x better than maokai at ap/support

Shield, saves lives
Root, saves lives and gets kills
Soil, is brutal AoE IF they actually get stuck standing on it
Ult can wreck a team and lock them all down with no aim and the ability to chase and move as needed for maximum effect

Maokai

Q, is worse than mediocre. Sure, IF you're pointblank you can knockback and interrupt someone, but the damage is ****, the range is ****, and the slow is only 2 seconds, ****ty for the range

W, is great... but IF you are going to do any damage with it, you wont have the survivability to live once you get there... compared to morgana's ranged and lifesteal/ap ratio happy equivalent

E is great IF your target a) is at the small aoe location when the slow ass throw finally lands b) stays around long enough to get hit by it, without someone else taking the hit or minions interfering

R, is wonderful IF a) your enemies are stupid enough to continue fighting inside or near your ring and b) if your teammates aren't stupid and stay inside your ring and c) you dont end it early and have the mana to sustain it

All of his abilities are situationally flawed, while other champions are simply effective in most situations.

TL;DR
His situationality (lol made-up words!) is not sufficiently compensated by mana cost, cooldown, or AP ratios. Nor are they buffered by superior base stats. It's as simple as that.


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Quarzark

Senior Member

02-19-2011

here is basically my end game as maokai should the game last that long:

Boot 2
Frozen Heart
Rod of Ages
Abyssal Scepter
Banshee's Veil/Lich's Bane (if they aren't a very magic oriented team and/or they're getting pooped on)
Rabadon's Deathcap

basically how I've been building him. While he is certainly not a very good tank, he is a BEAST anti-carry. basically ports with his root and puts an enemy ranged carry at 1/4 of their HP before they can even blink.


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DoenVayne

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Senior Member

02-20-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilamar View Post
Maokai can be a terror if you build him right. The games I've played him, I would toss a sapling and hit everyone for 1/4th their health.. best kills I've seen are E, then W to root them in place so they take the blast from E, then Q and they are hurt then your group hits them and they are dead. His ult is really good for champs who have ults like Nunu who can not move during their ult. You put your ult over his ult and he'll kill himself and you are still alive. Also Blitz is a great player to have on your team as he can pull and then you root and they aren't going anywhere but waiting for death timer.
His E is so imba it's not even fair. I've been playing him all day, and honestly, the best way to go is:

EWEQERE

And here's why:

At rank 4, you can wipe out the entire caster minions with a single E. That's 60 free gold every bomb. AND you can rope the other champs into it for good damage. Toss an E onto the caster cluster, then W in to root hero and run away. Seriously, the lulz never stop.

I usually rush Catalyst then build into a Rod of Ages for health/mana/AP.

Then I go weave in Merc Treads, then Glacial Shroud, Tear of the Goddess, Frozen Heart, Archangel, Rylai's, Rabadon's.

You'll wind up with 500-600ish AP, a mana pool that just doesn't end, and some of those HUGE range, massively-OP nuts blowing all over your enemy's team. ON TOP of this, his Ult will be a bruiser. With good health, decent resists, great mana, and 20% DR... the fights go a little like this:

Throw bomb. Stun in bomb. bomb blows up. R into ult. Q into middle of ult. deactivate ult.

it's more or less 2k damage up front, in a single skill flick.

Needs the right team to do it, but you'll be farming like a pro with those massive nuts and pressuring lane with the pile-driver of a W.


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