[Help] Twisted Fate

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Scizor

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Member

01-28-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigario View Post
i have a slightly technical question about TF. dont want to create a new thread for it.

I recently got back to playing TF havent played him since like 2 patches.

I realized i PAC a gold card a the fountain ult+gate to a hero. but somehow my TF tosses his gold card w/o me actually clicking on something. Sometimes its creeps. Kinda annoys me esp if i miss the kill.

Is this something new? i dont remember it being like this.
This can tend to happen, and is very frustrating when it does. However, If you're gating in with destiny up (as you usually will be in that offensive circumstance), right clicking will not cancel gate, so I have found it effective to repeatedly right click on the champ I'm targeting as I am gating in.

I don't have a solution for this when gating in without destiny up, as right clicking while gating normally will cancel it. However, in my experience, offensively gating without destiny up is used more for positioning (often to surprise your enemy), outside of their visible sight. Otherwise, they will have time to react to you and run away accordingly.


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Rigario

Member

01-28-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scizor View Post
This can tend to happen, and is very frustrating when it does. However, If you're gating in with destiny up (as you usually will be in that offensive circumstance), right clicking will not cancel gate, so I have found it effective to repeatedly right click on the champ I'm targeting as I am gating in.

I don't have a solution for this when gating in without destiny up, as right clicking while gating normally will cancel it. However, in my experience, offensively gating without destiny up is used more for positioning (often to surprise your enemy), outside of their visible sight. Otherwise, they will have time to react to you and run away accordingly.
oh thx for the tip didnt know about the destiny and gating thing. i assumed that it would always cancel the gate lol.


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AtlasNR

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Senior Member

01-28-2010

I myself have recently fallen back in love with Twisted Fate. (Haven't played him since the beta days of ridiculous wild cards.)

The only trouble i have with locking golds is when the gold is the very first in the round of PAC. I can lock them steadily any other time and I'm getting much better at handling it under pressure of team fights and such.

Is there some mathematical regularity to the time a gold will appear on the initial start-up of PAC? Or is it 100% random?

I can handle a initial red into gold but when it's maybe a millisecond of red right into gold I can't really nab it.


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karode

Member

01-29-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigario View Post
i have a slightly technical question about TF. dont want to create a new thread for it.

I recently got back to playing TF havent played him since like 2 patches.

I realized i PAC a gold card a the fountain ult+gate to a hero. but somehow my TF tosses his gold card w/o me actually clicking on something. Sometimes its creeps. Kinda annoys me esp if i miss the kill.

Is this something new? i dont remember it being like this.
I normally spam S when gating in so I don't auto attack. Honestly you may not need to spam it but I like pressing buttons. XP


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Cpspindel

Member

01-29-2010

The key to playing Twisted Fate is to have a good sense of timing. Don't look at the red card and try to time the golden card when you see it, that don't work- you've got to get a feeling for how long the red card is going to stay up, and then you press while it's still red, timing the golden card perfectly.

Simply, what you could do (and what I did) was to go into a practice game and just shuffle the deck to learn the timing of it.

An item I heartily recommend on him too:

Trinity force. It gives him sheen, which is a great item for him. He gets health from the mallet. He gets some movement, crit and attack speed from that other thing. Perhaps not optimal if you go with him as AP, but I never do- I play him as a jack of all trades.

Atlas: It always starts on blue... sort of. But if you've thrown a card already, and then use it shortly immediately after, it's going to resume it's shuffle on the last card you played for better or worse. That means if you've just thrown a golden card and shuffle again, the golden card will be first- but it is unlikely you will have the speed to catch it (if its even physically possible I don't know).


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Kadzin

Senior Member

01-29-2010

I might get some flame from other TF players but I personally don't think TF is hard.
The only skill that requires timing is PaC. Only other thing you need is quick fingers.
Here is a mini guide yay:
summoner spells: exhaust and flash (my personal favorites)
masteries: just make sure you pick up the ap ones the improved exhaust, magic penetration one and havok, everything else can be put in w/e.
runes: im assuming ur new and are not 30 yet, but ap and magic pen is nice if you dun have any runes that is also fine since TF can own without them
items: meki from start and 2 hp pots, core items are mejai's sorc shoes and lichbane after that pick up and void, if they are high on magic res, rod of ages if you feel too squishy and abysal for just damage, and a zonya's but games usually don't lst this long.
Gameplay: go into a lane, i recomend with a friend, but you could solo too. pick up 1 level of PaC and hide in a bush. as soon as you see someone, exhaust them and autoatack, while ur at it, use ur PaC and try to get a gold card, if you do get it, chances are the enemy will be dead, provided ur ally was helping you and nuking, and the enemy doesn't have cleanse and flash. keep farming try to last hit minions, PaC gold card oponents and get a couple of hits on them while they are stunned. Pump points into wild cards they are your bread and butter. and gate since you want it to have a short cooldown asap. PaC is really only useful for it's stun and not it's damage, so you can get the remaining 4 points last. On first trip home, get regular boots and mejai's (you can blue pill to base and then gate back) at base you can PaC get a gold card then gate in your lane and gank that way. Once you get destiny see if the oposing team has any twitches evelyns, and squishy carries like Ashe. Call a gank on someone. Again PaC first destiny and gate, stun wildcards win. TF is very dominant mid game and if farmed it transfers to late game. Once you get lichbane you can chunk towers with blue card spam. And that's pretty much it


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Beegly Boogs

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Senior Member

01-29-2010

TF is a joke to play well. Even if all you can manage to do is hit R at the correct time you'll still influence the game more than anyone.


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Hatebreeder

Junior Member

01-29-2010

I did the same thing. TFate was the first character I unlocked, and after failing miserably with him a few games I gave him up as terrible. After getting more game experience and finding numerous "nerf the cardmaster" threads, I gave him another shot and was a lot better with him. He's a good character, but he's unforgiving. One screw-up and you are very very likely dead on the spot. However once you streamline your TF game he becomes rather easy to play.

My advice, if you're not used to his abilities, try an attack speed/crit build. I don't have any in mind exactly but I know it can be done very effectively and it puts a lot less pressure on you in terms of abilities. With your hardcore AP build you have two abilities and lichbane, and otherwise no damage potential. With an attack build you actually have some good dps to save your ass when you need it, and your abilities are still very effective. As you get better, you can either switch to an AP build or refine your attack build if you really like it. I've seen very few high-level attack-Fate players, but they can hold their own when I do see them.


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systran

Junior Member

01-29-2010

I'll post a rundown of how I play TF, he's pretty much all I use since I started playing. First the build I use: I looked on December ELO chart and copied cfangnasty's build, as he was #1 ranked player. I doubt he'd care that I post his build here because it's freely viewable through pvp.net client.

1) Sapphire crystal + health pots
2) Sheen
3) Boots
4) Rod of Ages (usually get catalyst before blasting wand)
5) Sorc shoes
6) Void staff
7) Lich bane

Game is usually over before lich bane even, but afterward you can get Zhonya's or Deathfire I guess.

I just copied this build completely, but I definitely understand why it works. Soulstealer is nice if it works out, but if it doesn't you're paying 435 for an ability tome, then saving up a blasting wand's worth of gold for an upgrade that does nothing at the time of purchase. From the point when you first buy it, if you start getting kills immediately it's probably going to end up being worth it. If you don't or get a few kills then die, you'd probably have been better off without it. My biggest reason for not getting it though is that if you manage to get a kill/death/assist ratio that would have given you 20 stacks without the SS, then do you really need the SS? A lot of times I have teammates say "man if you had gotten SS you'd be unstoppable by now" but with this build mid-late game you are doing giant chunks of damage anyway; if one burst without SS does like 60-70% to a squishy character and 30-40% to a tank, unless the fully stacked SS actually killed them in one burst, the extra damage won't really matter. Getting rod of ages is, in my opinion, the smartest part of this build. It scales so well and the extra mana and health make a lot more sense during the laning phase than just stacking pure AP. or building a deathfire.

How you should play:

Summoner abilities: Clairvoyance and Flash or Clairvoyance and Cleanse

Clairvoyance is awesome early game for denying people that like to sit in the weeds during the whole laning phase, later on it's good for checking the river to see if an MIA is coming for you. Later game you can use it to check baron, check potential spots to gank without wasting destiny, etc. etc. The cooldown is so short that you get tons of use out of this.


1) PaC
2) WC
3) WC
4) Gate

After that just prioritize wildcard, when you can't level wildcard get PaC. When Destiny is a choice always get it, you want to reduce the cooldown on that asap. Max out gate last.

I like to solo mid; I really feel that TF is one of the best characters for soloing mid. He can kill creep waves exceptionally fast and can keep gating back for mana. If you don't solo mid, you can still clear whatever lane you are in very quickly, but you should probably try to help your lane partner gank someone fairly early if at all possible. Since you have a stun, you'll want to use it.

Start with PaC regardless, Wildcard isn't worth using until it's level 2, and you're not going to have level 2 WC until level 3 either way, so it's better to start out with a stun that you can use to last hit as well.

If you solo mid, just use gold card to threaten them and make them run back, then use it to last hit before it expires. If you can chip away at them and they aren't a character that heals for free like Chogoth or Gangplank, go for it. As soon as you get level 2 wildcard it's worth using on creeps. The ideal situation you want to create is you push the opponent back or scare him away from mid as each creep wave approaches mid, you want to get as close as you can to their tower without being unsafe and wildcard the creeps as they are in single file. Then you can usually get the second shot as they are still single file and about to hit each other.

If the character you are midding against is a really good harasser and insists on chipping away at you, just move back and kill the creeps. I've found that almost no one can kill the creeps faster than TF, so you'll at least create a stalemate mid, but you'll usually just have your creeps constantly pushing their tower while you remain at a safe distance.

If you run out of mana just wait until your creeps are pushed pretty far ahead, recall to fountain, buy whatever component of your build you can afford, and gate back in before you've lost any ground.

Usually you'll recall back in to buy an ability tome, sometimes you'll go straight for sheen. Don't recall if you're a few seconds from getting your ult, if you're like 60% to level six just hold out.

Once you get your ult, every time you are on the fountain and waiting for mana to recharge you need to quickly scan the map. Look at every lane for a weak or overextended target. Sometimes the guy you were mid against will be dumb enough to push your tower with half health, if you think he'll die you should Gold card, Destiny, Gate behind him and go for it. If not, look at top and bot and see if your using your ult and gating in with a gold card would help them out. More often than not you can see a pretty much guaranteed kill; go for it. If you don't see any possible kill, check mid and see if you can run back to mid without the tower getting hit. If you can get back on foot without tower taking hits, then run back and save your destiny/gate, if not you should probably just destiny gate onto the guy mid to push him off and maybe force a recall.

By level six you'll have sheen and you'll be building catalyst. You should be able to keep the creep waves back without much effort. At this point you have a lot more burst damage and you can start thinking about going for a non destiny/gate kill if you see your opponent mid getting dumb or walking around with too little health. It's usually worth it to pull a gold card, flash into range, stun, wc, autoattack with sheen proc, and then the second you do all that start running past them and try to pull another gold card. Only do this if you really think you'll get a kill. By that same token, keep in mind that your opponent is looking for the same chance. Characters like Teemo, Trist, Ashe all can do a similar thing. If you hit a mushroom, Teemo will probably flash onto you and burst all he has. Ashe will try to ult you, trist can rocketjump over you and ult you backward. Keep this in mind and be very cautious; this is why it's good to just clear creeps and go for sure kills instead of being needlessly risky.

If you kill the guy mid and there are no MIA's, get onto the tower behind a wave of creeps ASAP. Pull a blue card and right click the tower, then mash "w" as fast as you can. The sheen proc + blue card damage will take pretty good chunks off the tower. If you kill the guy mid and there are MIA's, I wouldn't hit the tower: it's a big risk that you'll get ganked from behind.

If you don't solo mid, just kill creeps fast like you would mid, and then abuse weeds to pull gold cards if possible. Try to work with your teammate to gank if you can, but it's more important to not feed than to go for risky ganks. The kind of ganks you want to get are gold carding someone who overextended slightly, bursting everything you have, and then backing up if he didn't die. Only push it or tower dive if it's a really sure thing. When you recall back to base and gate back in, consider gating back in to the weeds on the river when their creeps can't see it. Gate is visible even in weeds, so if their creeps are even in sight range you can't do this undetected. This can get you some nice free surprise ganks if your teammate is competent enough to take advantage of it.

After the laning phase is over, it's important that you stun in team fights, but if there is that situation where both teams kind of move back and forth in a stand-off, not wanting to engage, then you should try to throw wildcards and soften them up. After you finish rod of ages and start building void staff, your wildcards will start doing really huge chunks of damage. Also keep in mind that you can enter any team fight with a goldcard if you use your ult plus gate, so you are usually safe to push a lane or clear creeps somewhere and enter the fight at the last minute with a stun ready instead of having to run into it.

If destiny and gate are not on cooldown, it's fairly safe to solo push a lane really far, and then destiny gate out to safety if you get ganked.

Another thing to constantly look for is people getting badly damaged in a fight, running behind a tower, and starting to recall. If you see someone leave a fight with like 10% health, wait briefly and clairvoyance where you think they are recalling. Very often you'll catch them recalling behind their tower. This is a great time to destiny and gate in with a gold card, you'll usually kill them with the gold card alone and will be able to run out into their forest before anyone reacts and punishes you for it. This also applies to situations where you see your teammates chasing two or even three damaged people, destiny and gate in to cut them off, even if they could kill you alone, your teammates are coming up behind them. Usually they will all just keep running and hope you decide to stun their teammate and not them.

During team fights you need to stun characters like yi and tristana; anyone with huge lifesteal and fast attack speed that gets shut down easily by stuns. These type of characters are really squishy, so your goldcard wildcard autoattack combo will usually do over 50% damage to them. You also need to try to stay out of the fight; only get in range to gold card and burst, then back up until you can do it again. With rod of ages you'll have like 2k-2.5k hp late game, making you less of a target (I think this is the biggest advantage of the extra HP from rod of ages), I noticed that when I used builds that got no +HP items I was constantly getting focused as soon as the fight started, with rod of ages I rarely get focused. It's just a huge hassle for the other team to focus you if you are determined to run away as soon as you get hit. If they can't kill you in one burst they probably won't even try. If the fight starts getting lost by your team, don't just bail, but err on the side of caution. If your whole team wipes and you are the only survivor, you can do a lot to hold them off your towers/inhibs with just wildcard spawm. If you have to retreat and some teammates are still alive, pull a gold card and try to hit them best chaser with it. If you think getting in gold card range would get you stunned or killed, pull it anyway and spam wildcards. Having the gold card up will hopefully deter them from chasing, but if it doesn't you can still spam wildcard as you run and hope they give up.

I very rarely die as TF, I think this is one reason I really like him. On a good game I usually have 1 or 2 deaths and 8+ kills with quite a few assists. A bad game (where we are totally outmatched or I have feeder teammates) I still usually am just like 2/2. You have no excuse to feed as TF, so make sure you stay alive.

That's really all I can think of, for masteries get 9/21 offense/utility, for runes I get red: flat spell pen, yellow: flat mana regen, blue: cd reduc/level 18, quint: flat spell pen


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OmniOblivion

Senior Member

01-29-2010

TF relies heavily on his Gold Card. The timing is different for everyone (lag compensation). That is somethin' you need to experiment.

And like TMZILLA, you need to be able to pull out the card you need (or Gate/Destiny for that matter) at a moment's notice.


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