Rune Database Spreadsheet

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EnderA

Senior Member

08-04-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nivled View Post
Great spreadsheet. Based on the primary runes for each, what are the recommended runes to get?
From what I know
Marks : Crit Chance, Armor Pen, Magic Pen
Seals : Dodge, Mana Regen/Level, Health/Level
Glyphs : MR / Level, Cooldown Flat
Quint : Flat health

Are there any other runes worth getting?
That's most of them.

Magic Resist/lvl and flat Magic Resist are both good for glyphs. The off-primary Mana Regen/lvl glyphs are actually pretty good, if you'd prefer to use your seals for something else, or you're playing a mana-monster champion. (Kassadin/Zilean.)

Quints: I like Armor Pen, Magic Pen, Dodge, and Flat HP.


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Najster

Senior Member

08-04-2010

this is excellent. also showed me what are the good cheap runes to get in order to max out specific builds. These are all 1845 IP for 9 tier 3's, which is dirt cheap:

Seals - Mana Regen. Much better for laning with mana intensive heroes than my current dodge seals. Good with Annie, Kassadin, etc.
Glyphs - MR. Better for tank builds than just taking my current CDR glyphs.
Marks - no primary 1845 marks other than Attack Damage, although I still almost always will just prefer my standard 9 Armor Pen/Magic Pen. Maybe if I go a pure support Soraka/Janna/Taric, I might go for the 9 Mana Regen, although this seems like a luxury purchase and even then the standard 9 Penetration marks might be better.


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EnderA

Senior Member

08-10-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Najster View Post
this is excellent. also showed me what are the good cheap runes to get in order to max out specific builds.

<snip>
I'm glad it was helpful!

Bump.


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simpsonboy77

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Senior Member

08-16-2010

This excel sheet is AWESOME!

One minor minor thing, under Basic gold-stat table, Sage's ring was removed in a patch a while ago.


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xTenshi

Senior Member

08-20-2010

useful


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spacesloth

Junior Member

08-22-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by EnderA View Post
Yup, and that's why I think the choice of flat HP is very debatable. I really like having that starting bonus because early on you're very vulnerable to ganks and every bit of HP helps.

In my opinion, the Seals (the primary ones) are the closest in their effectiveness. I think they're all about the same, it just depends on what you're doing. If you love mana all the time, mana/5/lvl is very good. If you're playing Jax, Dodge seals are a must. If you're afraid of early ganks, or want to have that slight extra bit of HP for an early kill, Flat HP is great. If you just like general survivability the whole game, HP/lvl is good. If you're concerned about harassment early, HP/5 is good. If you're concerned about harassment the whole game, HP/5/lvl is good. If you like having physical defense, armor or armor/lvl isn't bad (considering most damage dealt is physical damage) although dodge is similar in function. (I'd probably get Dodge over either of the armor ones, unless you play Malphite or Rammus or get Thornmail a lot.)
Just curious because I keep reading that flat HP is good. If you go 9 seals and 3 quints for flat HP you can get ~150 HP. If, instead, you go with Armor you can get ~25 armor. If I understand the mechanics right then 25 armor should = 150 HP when you have 600 HP. Some champions start with close to 600 HP and many have that by lvl 2 and I think all champs have 600 HP by lvl 3. Also, if you begin with a Doran item then that should be enough to get you over 600 HP at lvl 1.

So, since 25 armor will scale much better than 150 HP wouldn't that be the way to go? Flat HP rune recommendations are so ubiquitous that I am sure I am not thinking through it correctly but am not sure why.

Edit: Also, with dodge (another frequently recommended rune) you can get ~11% from seals and quints. To me dodge is sort of the anti-crit. I always consider crit % as % extra damage. So if I am rolling with 100 damage and 11% crit then I consider that 111 damage. So for dodge If I had 100 HP and 11% dodge I would consider that 111 HP. Dodge does scale nicely but I would rather have 25 armor than 11% dodge as 100 HP with 25 armor would be equal to 125 HP no?

2nd Edit: I divided the equivalence column for quints by 3 which made it so < 1 would mean not as valuable as the primary and > 1 is better value than primary. After that I see why flat HP quints stick out but I am still thinking I prefer armor seals over flat HP or dodge seals. In fact, the equivalence difference makes the armor seals compared to flat HP seals an even better prospect that way I am looking at it. As in I see no advantage in flat HP seals over armor seals at all.


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EnderA

Senior Member

08-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by simpsonboy77 View Post
This excel sheet is AWESOME!

One minor minor thing, under Basic gold-stat table, Sage's ring was removed in a patch a while ago.
Ah, thank you for the correction. I'll update it in a while. I'm quite busy at the moment, and it's not all that severe of an error.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spacesloth View Post
Just curious because I keep reading that flat HP is good. If you go 9 seals and 3 quints for flat HP you can get ~150 HP. If, instead, you go with Armor you can get ~25 armor. If I understand the mechanics right then 25 armor should = 150 HP when you have 600 HP. Some champions start with close to 600 HP and many have that by lvl 2 and I think all champs have 600 HP by lvl 3. Also, if you begin with a Doran item then that should be enough to get you over 600 HP at lvl 1.

So, since 25 armor will scale much better than 150 HP wouldn't that be the way to go? Flat HP rune recommendations are so ubiquitous that I am sure I am not thinking through it correctly but am not sure why.

Edit: Also, with dodge (another frequently recommended rune) you can get ~11% from seals and quints. To me dodge is sort of the anti-crit. I always consider crit % as % extra damage. So if I am rolling with 100 damage and 11% crit then I consider that 111 damage. So for dodge If I had 100 HP and 11% dodge I would consider that 111 HP. Dodge does scale nicely but I would rather have 25 armor than 11% dodge as 100 HP with 25 armor would be equal to 125 HP no?

2nd Edit: I divided the equivalence column for quints by 3 which made it so < 1 would mean not as valuable as the primary and > 1 is better value than primary. After that I see why flat HP quints stick out but I am still thinking I prefer armor seals over flat HP or dodge seals. In fact, the equivalence difference makes the armor seals compared to flat HP seals an even better prospect that way I am looking at it. As in I see no advantage in flat HP seals over armor seals at all.
Yeah, I agree. After a more thorough analysis, I've come to the conclusion flat HP seals are bad. I prefer HP/lvl, Dodge, or MP regen/lvl. Armor and armor/lvl are good, too, especially if you're jungling.


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Tethax

Junior Member

10-18-2010

I was looking up top ELO champions (found a list from back in January. :P ) and read somewhere there are some folks who pick the random champion. this, hurt my brain a little... the only way one can do that well is to have a runepage setup which works universally. so, i googled "League of Legends Universal Runes"... and found this treasure.

please sticky this.


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JohnCataldo

Senior Member

10-19-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by spacesloth View Post
Just curious because I keep reading that flat HP is good. If you go 9 seals and 3 quints for flat HP you can get ~150 HP. If, instead, you go with Armor you can get ~25 armor. If I understand the mechanics right then 25 armor should = 150 HP when you have 600 HP. Some champions start with close to 600 HP and many have that by lvl 2 and I think all champs have 600 HP by lvl 3. Also, if you begin with a Doran item then that should be enough to get you over 600 HP at lvl 1.

So, since 25 armor will scale much better than 150 HP wouldn't that be the way to go? Flat HP rune recommendations are so ubiquitous that I am sure I am not thinking through it correctly but am not sure why.
If you are going to multiply your starting health for armor runes, you have to multiply the starting armor for health runes. You fail to do the multiplication the other way for the health runes. Every champion starts with both armor and magic resist. A champion with 20 armor gets +20 effective health vs. physical per 100 health in armor runes.

Health also works against magic damage. If you want to compare health vs. armor, and you expect to take equal amounts of magic and physical damage, you have to double the value the of the health for it to make sense (since the armor works only half the time), ALSO factoring in armor and magic resist as multipliers for the starting health.

Both health and armor increase as a champion levels, as well, so when you say most champions will have 600 health by level 3, you need to factor in the amount of armor champions will have at level 3 as well.

Quote:
In fact, the equivalence difference makes the armor seals compared to flat HP seals an even better prospect that way I am looking at it. As in I see no advantage in flat HP seals over armor seals at all.
If your enemies are Ryze, Veigar, and Annie, your armor does almost nothing at all. (Yes, they will probably autoattack you, but that's maybe 5% of their damage or less against champions.)

All of that said, it's a matter of early game vs. late game and expected item buys and enemies. Health is better early against unknown enemies. Armor and MR tends to scale better late in the game with high health (e.g. tanks), which is stronger than your 100 health scaling with high armor later.

Late game tanks may easily have 3000+ health; 25 armor gives +750 health vs. physical. This same champion with health runes might have 100 - 200 armor. Having 150 health from runes gives +150 health vs. physical with 100 armor, or +300 health vs. physical with 200 armor. Of course, that still doesn't account for health working against magic (and factoring in MR).

More pointedly, when you choose runes in ranked games you can factor in the enemy. Most often you'll want generic runes, which is to say health. If you can clearly see the enemy is skewing towards magic or physical, you can select the appropriate rune page. (But you still can't know who will really be carrying for the other team yet, which should affect your item decisions. If Annie is 10-2 while the rest of the team is 0-5, you need MR even if the rest of the team is physical. Etc.)

Of course, the simplest answer is flat health quints, armor seals and MR glyphs, for most tanks that really want defense focus. A bit of everything.


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Tank7

Member

10-30-2010

Er found out the answer to my question... Delete this post if you can.