Advice on Turrets

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Chaafii

Junior Member

02-06-2011

Been playing a week. Starting to grasp how people expect me to play. But one situation leaves me stumped: taking down turrets during the laning phase. I'm fairly certain if you've got 2 champs facing 2 champs, you should just hold back. But what about when you've got 2 champs facing 1? I believe, ideally, you want a tank in the equation and you send him in first to absorb, but a few questions about that...

1) Is the priority always killing the enemy champ first? If they go into ranged harrass mode, do you switch to turret or just get out of there?

2) I'm playing solo, non-ranked games and I'm level 14. Most people, like myself, play a character they know. I'm usually not partnered with a tank or they don't play him as I'd expect. How might that change your thinking?

3) Would you advise me to simply not worry about turret kills (short of it being completely defenseless) until the point in the game where we start grouping 3 or more champs together? If so, I'm playing Xin Shao on a pushed lane that's ending in a stalemate. Should I look to jump lanes and seek a gank? It seems like a good idea for Xin, but I often get called noob if I don't excercise lane discipline.

The questions are just a framework. More than anything, I'm trying to get into the thinking process of a veteren facing this situation. Thanks for your consideration.


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Crazyflames

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Senior Member

02-06-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaafii View Post
Been playing a week. Starting to grasp how people expect me to play. But one situation leaves me stumped: taking down turrets during the laning phase. I'm fairly certain if you've got 2 champs facing 2 champs, you should just hold back. But what about when you've got 2 champs facing 1? I believe, ideally, you want a tank in the equation and you send him in first to absorb, but a few questions about that...

1) Is the priority always killing the enemy champ first? If they go into ranged harrass mode, do you switch to turret or just get out of there?

2) I'm playing solo, non-ranked games and I'm level 14. Most people, like myself, play a character they know. I'm usually not partnered with a tank or they don't play him as I'd expect. How might that change your thinking?

3) Would you advise me to simply not worry about turret kills (short of it being completely defenseless) until the point in the game where we start grouping 3 or more champs together? If so, I'm playing Xin Shao on a pushed lane that's ending in a stalemate. Should I look to jump lanes and seek a gank? It seems like a good idea for Xin, but I often get called noob if I don't excercise lane discipline.

The questions are just a framework. More than anything, I'm trying to get into the thinking process of a veteren facing this situation. Thanks for your consideration.
1. The priority of turrets is whatever comes into range is what it targets first, than if an enemy champ attacks an allied champ the enemy will be targeted. But it will not target them otherwise unless they are the last one there

2. If you don't have a tank, make sure you have map awareness (even with a tank this helps) if you have a tanky DPS they should substitute as the tank and everybody should build 2 tanky dps items (abyssal scepter for example gives magic resist and good damage.) instead of just spiraling twards building pure dps.

3 Turret dive when you have multiple people and they are at low HP, you know what they can do to escape and they can be 1-2 shotted and you can get away, and finaly when you would benefit more from killing them than them killing you (if your trying to kill a vlad with his pool up and he has flash, don't try) Changing lanes is very benefitial if you get a tower or kill, the only time it is not is if the targets escape to defend the lane.

Finally you could just get Poppy and tower dive whoever you want .


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xpsychedelico

Senior Member

02-06-2011

1. This really depends on the enemy champions and if they have a jungler. If they have a jungler, it's not always wise to push beyond the river, as it makes you vulnerable to ganks. You do want to try and get kills during the laning phase, but never put yourself or your lanemate in a disadvantageous situation if you can. So, try not to tower dive, or engage when it's to your disadvantage. This requires experience to gauge, but the more you play, the easier it will be to tell.

2. Best way is to adapt your playstyle to theirs. You can try giving them pointers, but most people do not listen. So if you have an aggressive teammate, use his distraction to take out the weakest opponent, and ask him to focus the weakest guy as well. If you have a passive teammate, you might just want to sit back and farm by playing defensively. Harassing is fine, but don't expect a kill if you run in. Ideally, you should have a rough idea of how all the champions play. You should definitely try out all the free champions once during the week so you can anticipate what your teammates and enemies will do, and how you might counter them.

3. Usually towers don't go down during the laning phase unless you have a push heavy team, like Sivir and Taric. Ganks usually help you get towers, but you don't want to leave a lane against a strong pusher to gank a lane with mages. Mages push less hard compared to DPS champs, so weigh your options before you decide. Again, this will be easier to tell with time and experience.


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Absinthe

Senior Member

02-06-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaafii View Post
Been playing a week. Starting to grasp how people expect me to play. But one situation leaves me stumped: taking down turrets during the laning phase. I'm fairly certain if you've got 2 champs facing 2 champs, you should just hold back. But what about when you've got 2 champs facing 1? I believe, ideally, you want a tank in the equation and you send him in first to absorb, but a few questions about that...

1) Is the priority always killing the enemy champ first? If they go into ranged harrass mode, do you switch to turret or just get out of there?

2) I'm playing solo, non-ranked games and I'm level 14. Most people, like myself, play a character they know. I'm usually not partnered with a tank or they don't play him as I'd expect. How might that change your thinking?

3) Would you advise me to simply not worry about turret kills (short of it being completely defenseless) until the point in the game where we start grouping 3 or more champs together? If so, I'm playing Xin Shao on a pushed lane that's ending in a stalemate. Should I look to jump lanes and seek a gank? It seems like a good idea for Xin, but I often get called noob if I don't excercise lane discipline.
Short answers:
1.) No.
2.) In a 2v1 situation your objective isn't always to push the turret, depending on your opponent is, its best to try to deny them (both of you get behind the enemy minions and create enough space where they wont be able to last hit at all, or even receive experience.
3.) Early game you should be farming, playing somewhat defensive, and taking advantage of enemy mistakes - in your lane or not.


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SomniumProxy

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Senior Member

02-06-2011

First of all, keep in mind that your primary goal at all times is to create the biggest power difference between you and your oponents. Iv used correctly, this will lead to the destruction of the nexus. Everything you do in the game must serce this purpose.

In laning phase, there are a number of things you can do. You can kill your oponents. You can zone them out of experience range and thus keep them underleveld and underfarmed. You can push the turret.

Keepn in mind that those 3 use strategies that are not compatible with one an other. If you want to push the turret, you can't zone them and vice versa. If you want to kill someone, you probably won't be focusing the turret. If you want to kill, you also have to let them closer so zoning is a lot harder (not completely impossible, but reduced).

Aside from perfect scenarios like taking a double kill and then pushing the turrets, in most games you must evaluate your chances of reaching these goals and choosing on which one to focus. Your choice must be a fine balance between what is best and what is most likely to happen.

Here are some things to consider about your situation:

-who are you playing against? How capable is he to defend? What role will he fill later on?
If you're 2v1 against a Vlad, for example, then you know that he can take both of you down once he gains some level and he can defend the turret. He scales perfectly for mid game. Best option is to zone him. If you're playing against someone who is a healer, but isn't the rbightest defender nor late game carry (example: nidalee), feel free to press the turret.

-what's happening in the pther lanes? Do they have a jungle?
if the enmey has a jungler, it's dangerous to overextend and press the turret. If you still want to do it, proceed only if you have wards to cover you from ganks.
Look at the other lanes. how important is that turret? If your team is already dominating, you can play it safe. If you feel that the battle is on an edge, you can risk and go for the turret, the bonus gold and experience might just draw the scales in your direction.

-the turret is hard to push. should you even be pushing it?
It's not always beneficial to slam your head in a wall. If the lane is hard, consider switching. You can always leave 1 person to defend and go gank mid, put some wards, intercept their jungler, go to bottom and push the turret there having 3 people down, etc. There are options. You can even farm some neutrals.

-Do you have teleport and/or teleporting champions like TF, Shen, pantheon? Then you can lure the majority of their team somewhere else, then leave your best defenders there and the rest can tp to push an other lane.

You should always be ready to adapt. Think in every moment - What will create the biggest difference in power. Not just let you farm, but prevent your enemies from doing so. If you're gonna trade, think carefully what you're trading. If what you decided doesn't work, don't be afraid to a dmit it and change your strategy. When you see a loss, try to minimize the losses: don't defeat turrets that are hopeless, you only risk getting yourself killed. Don't help dead teammates, one death is enough.

Try to put pressure. Intimidate your oponents. If you're having a flawless performence, even if you advance slowly, they will likely loose patience and make mistakes. So don't head on. plan, anticipate. Try to take what is best without getting into unneccessairy risks.


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Chaafii

Junior Member

02-06-2011

Thank you kindly for all the great replies. This has given me much to think about. The zoning/denying principle is very compelling. It sounds challenging, both in terms of individually and getting my partner on the same page. It seems to me that both you and your partner have to be skilled at and dedicated to one-shotting or else you'll end up pushing the lane too far.

More than anything, the advice I get from others and personal experience points to 3 lessons:

1) patience
2) more patience
3) discipline

Cheers