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Why all the AD Kog'Maw hate?

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sanajin

Recruiter

02-03-2011

I'm just wondering where all this hate on AD Kog'Maw is coming from. I started playing Kog'Maw a lot a few days ago, and I've been having a blast. I've played almost exclusively AD, because that's just what made sense to me. I see the potential for AP, and I'm very excited after reading some guides to try it out, but I don't understand why people hate on AD so much. I keep seeing, "if you play AD stop playing kog" and other such dramatic statements. Though in the games I've played lately the remarks are more along the lines of "kog OP"

Anyone know what I'm talking about, and/or can shed some light on this?


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Redenbacher

Senior Member

02-03-2011

Because everyone sees AD, or AP... and rarely anything in between. Just because you use Madred's, doesn't mean you have to build pure AD.

AD is not making the best use of your gold spent because AD doesn't benefit any of his skills... they ALL do magic damage, and are boosted by AP.

AP is not making the best use of your gold spent because his ultimate is his most spammable ability and it has a poor ratio, his other two nukes also have fairly long cooldowns, and W has a poor AP ratio. This means that champions like Annie and Malzahar, etc. are much better suited for the AP nuke on the team.

My preference is an AS/MPen/AP hybrid. I use Madred's Bloodrazor, because not doing so just ignores an incredibly effective damage and offensive boost. Then, I use items that provide MPen, like Sorc Shoes, MPen Marks, Haunting Guise. Other core items I enjoy using include Nashor's Tooth, some survivability - usually banshee's Veil or Frozen Mallet - Sword of the Divine, Rabadon's Deathcap (2% more on W).

MPen is incredibly under used on every Kog I see. They build Bloodrazor and use W, but with just a little MR, you're dealing a fraction of the damage you could be doing. With just a little MR penetration, you can deal true damage on most targets. Furthermore, MPen is the BEST way to increase the damage of your ultimate, by a long shot. The 150% bonus to champions is based off it's BASE damage, not off the AP boosted damage, so you amplify that with MPen.

Now, in the event the enemy is stacking MR to the hilt, you can always mix it up and throw an IE in there after you've taken care of your Bloodrazor/Mpen items. This gives you a nice damage balance that is difficult to itemize against. Most of the time however, you're best focusing on magic damage, at least in my experience.

I DON'T like using Malady, because I hate that I have to hit them 6 times to start dealing the damage I want to deal. Ideally, you want to be hitting them as hard as possible from strike 1, to no more than 10, and ensure their death. Also, you can't apply the debuff when you're poking at range with your ultimate.

Some people SWEAR by tear on Kog. I respectfully disagree. They say it's for R spam... I say for 40 mana, what do I need all of that mana for? There are better ways to spend my gold. I use Mp5/level seals, and Meditation. I find I don't need any more than that. Poking someone for 120/300/400 damage every 6 seconds is more powerful than most pokes in the game... I can wait, have some patience. Also, thanks to the Razor part of Bloodrazors - grabbing golem is simple, and fast. No need for any mana regen items outside of Tooth.


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Raigeki Oni

Senior Member

02-03-2011

AD is a perfectly viable build for Kog'Maw don't let people tell you otherwise. Madreds + W skill does large amounts of damage. When i play Kog it's usually Bloodrazer + boots + phage(mallet) and it's enough to carry.

Is also don't play Kog for anything else other than fun. So thus there are better Kog'Maw players out there to ask :P


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Gunflame

Senior Member

02-03-2011

Do you mean AD as is IE... or AD as in Madred's BR, which is AS kogmaw?


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Artemis66X

Junior Member

02-03-2011

AD kog'maw is hard to counter imo. In most matches people get either more armour or more mag. res depending on who is tearing them up. With AD kog you always have a strong attk that get through whatever they aren't stacking

artillery still hits like a truck when you are finishing people off, ooze is there just for the slow at endgame vs. other champs, caustic spittle's active is very short range so, you just get it for the attk speed
bio-arcane barrage gives that %hp damage which will tear up tanks who only get hp when combined with madred's if they have no mag resist, but also gives you the range to just keep on hitting them with you regular attack.
AD kog is in no way weak, but gives you a fallback against people stacking mag. resist


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sanajin

Recruiter

02-03-2011

Thanks for the thoughtful responses. I'm definitely going to try the hybrid route of bloodrazor and mpen.

I've been using my Tryndamere runes that give me +14% crit, and I've been rushing Phantom Dancer and maxing W then Q. I think this has been successful because the combination of W's range with my attack speed and crit chance allows me to land a ton of critical strikes before the enemy realizes they're in trouble, often allowing me to just finish them off with R.

By switching to bloodrazor and mpen I'd be sacrificing some attack speed and crit chance, but gaining a lot of damage against tanks and a stronger R. I want to try this, but I'm wondering if this will only be more effective against HP/armor stackers.

What do you guys think of Nashor's Tooth, Trinity Force and Guinsoo's Rageblade? Not necessarily all in the same build, but as items for Kog in general.


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Urr

Senior Member

02-03-2011

Let the haters hate, and let your play speak for itself


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sanajin

Recruiter

02-03-2011

Quote:
Urr:
Let the haters hate, and let your play speak for itself


Thanks. I've been creaming with Kog most games with my as/crit/dmg build. I was at 10/2/something the other day and the enemy Twitch tells me that AP kog is way better. I figure if I'm doing this well with my current strategy...I better investigate this...


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Redenbacher

Senior Member

02-03-2011

Quote:
sanajin:
What do you guys think of Nashor's Tooth, Trinity Force and Guinsoo's Rageblade? Not necessarily all in the same build, but as items for Kog in general.


I haven't actually tried Rageblade on him, because the game usually ends after Nashor's - but it certainly doesn't sound bad on paper.

Trinity force seems like it would be good, but in my experience the results were 'meh' at best. It's just expensive and slow to build.

Nashor's I like because the AP will bump you up 1% on W, the CDR keeps W up as often as possible with a 9/0/21 build, and the AS and mana regen are self explanatory.


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sanajin

Recruiter

02-03-2011

Quote:
Redenbacher:
I haven't actually tried Rageblade on him, because the game usually ends after Nashor's - but it certainly doesn't sound bad on paper.

Trinity force seems like it would be good, but in my experience the results were 'meh' at best. It's just expensive and slow to build.

Nashor's I like because the AP will bump you up 1% on W, the CDR keeps W up as often as possible with a 9/0/21 build, and the AS and mana regen are self explanatory.


Bumps you up to 1% because .01 of 55 = .55 which is rounded up to 1? That's pretty nifty, considering the other bonuses this item also gives.

Yeah trinity sounds like it has lots of things Kog wants but I never get it because it seems like a, "jack of all trades, master of none" result. But I'd prefer to be the master... of killing. : )