Autoattacking in Laning Phase

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Exantius

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01-07-2010

I'm curious if the Dota "autoattacking is bad" mentality still holds. It's even easier now that you can just use the Stop command and just wait until a creep drops low as opposed to running back and forth or spamming the stop button.

On one end, tower kills give almost a snowball effect due to global experience and gold and getting them isn't particularily hard. The different tower AI makes it so you can somewhat freely autoattack the tower whenever you have creeps near them, and of course assuming your opponents can't stop you from last hitting every minion away from towers, there are times where towers can snipe down one or two kills. Vampiric Scepter with autoattacking also offers the highest regen early game (other than potions), but that's only if you constantly attack.

On the other hand, against a heavily harassing team, getting last hits near towers is particularily nice. Really all you have to do is memorize whether it takes 1 or 2 of your own hits plus 1 (for ranged creep) or 2 (for melee creep) tower hits to take down a mob, and then just go with that. The tower even tells you who it's going to attack beforehand, though of course your own minions arriving can screw it up now and then.

I would think that a stronger ability to push early game alongside the removal of denying would allow for smart autoattacking (autoattacking with no regards to last hitting is just terrible though and should never be done even in endgame), but force of habit still makes me sit around waiting for creep healths to drop just enough.


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wildfire393

Senior Member

01-07-2010

A smart opponent, when facing a lane with autoattackers, will just hug their turret and mop up the creeps that get to it. You'll never take the turret, you'll never get kills, they'll still advance in Exp and gold, and if they're smart or you push your luck they'll stun you under the tower when your last creeps are dying and you'll take tower hits and possibly get ganked yourself. Not to mention the increased risk of someone coming down the river from mid and killing you.


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ThatSaulSheWrote

Senior Member

01-07-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by wildfire393 View Post
A smart opponent, when facing a lane with autoattackers, will just hug their turret and mop up the creeps that get to it. You'll never take the turret, you'll never get kills, they'll still advance in Exp and gold, and if they're smart or you push your luck they'll stun you under the tower when your last creeps are dying and you'll take tower hits and possibly get ganked yourself. Not to mention the increased risk of someone coming down the river from mid and killing you.
I kind of disagree with this. hugging turrets just isn't that safe for extended periods. It will make you lose a turret and it will eventually get you killed...

Op-
Basically, unless you are pushing a lane in an attempt to stop an opposing push/ take a tower you dont really want the creep line to move much in either direction. Focus on last hitting as it leaves you safe longer if you are melee. Also, the position of the creeps in the lane makes it more difficult to gank you.


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Beegly Boogs

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Senior Member

01-07-2010

Hugging turrets is great, especially if you have someone like alistar or blitz. It's also good to let your solo mid come gank top / bottom because they have to be past the half way point to get xp / gold.


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condon

Senior Member

01-07-2010

Auto attack the **** out of them creeps whitey. If you are standing just outside of tower range, super! They cant get half as many kills because their tower keeps last hitting on them, and you can casually pick off creep as you like. Remember: The tower ignores you unless they hit you or you're out of creep. If they hit you, your creep starts hitting them. If you play smart, even as a melee character, you can dance in and out around their tower like you own the place. If you happened to be playing a ranged character, all the better. Don't be stupid and fall for ganks, and ffs don't auto attack a creep from full when you could get three last hits in the same timeframe. The point is to put on pressure to deprive them of gold, while still farming yourself. EXP will be the same either way.

tl;dr auto attacking is good, as it deprives the enemy of mobility and gold generation.

Edit: Forgot to mention, this is only really recommended if you have big manly balls, not mincy little ****** balls.


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Yana

Senior Member

01-07-2010

It's also pretty much impossible to last hit effectively when you're tower hugging. Sure, you can get the melee creep since 2 shots of the tower puts them on minimal health, but with the ranged creep, 1 shot cuts them down to 45% or so health, and the next one finishes them off. Hence, you simply cannot get the ranged creep if you're towerhugging.

Personally I just like to be flexible, depending on what hero I am and how the situation is. I try to control how far the lane moves in each direction. The situation for what is best is mostly quite intuitive. For example, if I'm doing well and a ranged character, I like it to push it to their tower. If I'm melee, I definitely don't want that. If 'm planning on going for a kill, I want it closer to my tower if possible. If I'm being defensive and likely to need to tower hug, I want it as close to my tower as possible, so definitely last hitting there.

Some heroes also determine where you want the creep wave. For example, as Zilean you can still very effectively harrass even if the wave is right at your opponents tower, whereas they can't properly farm (since the tower steals the kills). If I'm singed / rammus, definitely want it closer to mine.

Ah, and naturally just straight autoattacking is bad, since you don't farm well. Autoattack + lasthitting is what's good.


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bobthegood

Senior Member

01-07-2010

I think the decision is matchup dependent. If they have gank heavy guys like a jungle warwick/eve/twitch, I would want the creeps closer to my tower. If we have a good kill combo for early game, I would want them in the middle. If we are ranged and they are not, barring Blitzcrank, lets push for an early tower kill.


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rEv3

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Senior Member

01-08-2010

You want your opponent to be tower hugging. While he's last hitting your creeps, you hit his tower. Once your creep are dead and u pull away, you harass him so that the only time he can get last hits in is near his tower. When he's at your tower... attack him (but try as same time to clear out his creep so he can't attack your tower) then in neutral territory again you can go back to driving him away from the creep so that you have exclusive farming.. until you push it back to his tower where hopefully he'll do nothing but last hit as you take his tower down.