Being Effective With Tristana (Vet Trist Players)

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Cujo

Junior Member

01-07-2010

I'm having trouble with mid-game and late-game Tristana (sometimes early game but that's if I solo lane against a teemo). I don't seem to do so much damage past early game and can't seem to get any ganks. Is there a way I can increase my dmg output and burst so that I could be a threat to the other team? Or use something that will be effective in teamfights because I can't seem to contribute as the other players on my team.

My build:

Boots Of Speed+3 Pots
Beserker Greaves
Frozen Mallet
Black Cleaver
Phantom Dancer

Any tips against teemo as tristana? I get DESTROYED by average to pro teemos that solo, hit so much compared to my dmg output.

Skill Build:

Buster Shot>Explosive Shot>Rapid Fire>Rocket Jump

I start of with level 1 Rocket Jump until I maxed out other skills.


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Basilisk9466

Senior Member

01-07-2010

1. No survivability.
2. Poor damage.
3. You're fighting Teemo by autoattacks.

I'll expand. Tristana, in my opinion, is even stronger than Teemo as a solo laning harasser. Teemo, and possibly Fiddle, come close seconds, but Trist has a brutal harass in the form of Explosive Shot.

Teemo has two harasses - he has poison and blinding shot. One adds up to one or more free auto attacks in DoT, one prevents you from autoattacking. This means that you have to kite him, and do not end up in an autoattack shooting match, which you will lose. If he's aggressive, be ready to Explosive Shot him when he comes up for his Blinding Dart. Your damage is higher, and if you retreat straight away, he won't get poison shot off. If he does poison before Dart, you win even more.

It takes practice, and a really good Teemo can still give you a hard time, but I haven't lost to a Teemo in mid since I started this practice. I would personally advise taking Explosive 1st level, Rocket 2nd, and save Rocket for GTFOing.

This is the key point. Early on, Tristana's abilities (buster, explosive and rocket) dominate, even without AP. Your autoattack is for farming. The other important thing is that although kills are nice, getting them to BP is almost as good.

Midgame there is an almost unavoidable dropoff, though judicious use of Rapid Fire helps. Your abilities have been left behind for damage dealing, and your autoattack is simply poor. Stick to laning (or stick with the group if team battles are beginning to form) and don't try to take any risks.

Late game, your damage has caught up, Rapid Fire is maxed, and you can slaughter most opponents, particularly in a group.

Build-wise, you have some dodge, 750 health from Frozen Mallet, and a total of +95 damage, +70% AS. Seems good, isn't. You're squishy as hell, not terribly quick, and have no regen of any kind. You're fodder for the first Yi/Warwick/Annie/whoever that turns up.

The build I've always used (though I'm beginning to experiment with it) goes:

Bead of Regeneration, 3 HP pots, MP pot

As long as you don't get nuked down, this gives you a lot of staying power in your lane, which is key.

Bead -> Emblem of Valour, Boots of Speed

You've quite possibly used all your pots by this point, but lifesteal and boosted health regen should help you stick around.

Emblem of Valour -> Stark's Fervour

Stark's gives you a bit of everything, and the aura is definitely a plus for your teammates. (Please nobody start that 'only one Starks in a team' ****.)

Bloodthirster

Build this how you like, depending on when you get the chance to go buy stuff, but make it a priority. It gives you an excellent damage boost, and marks the point where your game starts picking up again.

Malady, Berserker's Greaves

Between your three AS items and lvl 5 rapid fire, you're hitting 2.5, so from here on in, it's all about damage. Exactly what is up to you - a heavy carry team might encourage another Bloodthirster, tanks a Black Cleaver, Infinity Edge for a mixture. Use your own judgement.

With Starks, Malady and 'thirster, you have 60% lifesteal, can hit maximum AS, and have a comfortable 200-odd damage. Your DPS isn't the highest possible, but you are very resilient thanks to your long range and insane lifesteal - I've managed to weather having Yi's pounding on me long enough to gank them (Explosive Shot nerfs lifesteal, make sure you use it on a lifesteal Carry!). As you proceed, your farming becomes ever better, so earning gold becomes easy. You want Lizard Buff as much as possible, Frozen Mallet isn't really worth it.


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Nihili

Senior Member

01-07-2010

I'm far from being a Veteran Trist player, but your problem seems quite simple to me.

Quote:
I don't seem to do so much damage past early game and can't seem to get any ganks
(...)
My build:

Boots Of Speed+3 Pots
Beserker Greaves
Frozen Mallet
How do you want to do much damage when your first 4k spent grants you only +20 dmg? And since BF sword is almost 2k, with that build you can't get more than +30dmg before getting ~6k cash. Getting Frozen Mallet at the start is giving you a lot of health that you don't need for the cash you could use to get damage. If you really need the slow, (though Rocket Jump should be your slow) then get a Phage and don't build the Mallet. IMO you could skip Phage/Mallet totally and just get the Lizard buff mid-game for the slow.

If you spend so much cash for HP (that you don't really need if you're careful) that you could use for farming/dmg items, you'll get cash starved later game, and won't be able to catch up to enemies that will be constantly getting heaps of gold.

And about ganking, i don't know how to help you. If you know how to set up ganks, then getting the kills, or at least assists (though you should be getting the kills as the carry) shouldn't be a problem past lvl 6. Trist is a great ganker. Otherwise you'll just have to learn it.


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Reivur

Senior Member

01-07-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cujo View Post
My build:

Boots Of Speed+3 Pots
Beserker Greaves
Frozen Mallet
Black Cleaver
Phantom Dancer
It really comes down to item choices. The items you're choosing don't really do you very many favors other than Black Cleaver for damage. And the thing about Black Cleaver is its built around doing consecutive hits; that in itself is not a bad thing when you use Rapid Fire, but it being the full source of your damage won't help you very much.

You may want to consider getting rid of the Frozen Mallet or buying it much later and getting an Infinity Edge in its place. Personally I skip Frozen Mallet; I understand why people like it, but I opt instead to jungle and get the Lizard Buff for more sustained damage/DoTs as well as the snare component.

I also tend to get a Stark's rather than a Black Cleaver so I can get instant gratification of the armor down effect as well as life steal; however, that's a situational purchase based upon if others in my group will be buying it or not. If someone else is getting Stark's, Black Cleaver is AOK. If there's a really nasty high HP tank like Cho'Gath in the game, I get a Blood Razor instead.

As for Teemo he tends to teleograph his intentions a bit much. If he suddenly pokes his head past a minion or two to reach you due to your superior range, a blinding shot is coming. You have two options.

1) Jump away (I don't suggest this; save this for when people come in to gank you or if you feel what he's about to do can kill you.)

2) Punish him with an explosive shot. It will be a trade of his blinding shot versus your explosive shot, and unless its an AP Teemo, you win the trade. If its an AP Teemo, you still probably manage well off just because he more than likely doesn't have life steal.

Make sure you don't use rapid shot much. While you'll likely want to train it as your secondary skill other than the single obligatory point behind Rocket Jump but you should save using that for pushing a tower or in a 5v5 when you aren't being focused. In single laning you'll likely get a second shot in at best when they retreat out of range and a bucket load of wasted mana. Explosive is your harass/punish.

Oh, and if the mushrooms are a problem either ward the area or get Mercury Treads. Mercury Treads hard counter mushrooms so hard that one could go so far as to say its unfair to Teemo.


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MBirk

Senior Member

01-07-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Basilisk9466 View Post


Teemo has two harasses - he has poison and blinding shot. One adds up to one or more free auto attacks in DoT, one prevents you from autoattacking. This means that you have to kite him, and do not end up in an autoattack shooting match, which you will lose. If he's aggressive, be ready to Explosive Shot him when he comes up for his Blinding Dart. Your damage is higher, and if you retreat straight away, he won't get poison shot off. If he does poison before Dart, you win even more.
Teemo's poison is passive on his autoattack.

to the op,
Blinding dart is going to ruin your day in a head to head fight vs teemo. And chasing him into brush or off the main path into mushrooms will get you killed very quick as well.

Kiting him/using rocketjump to escape (early) is going to help alot.


Mallet that early is a bad idea as others have said. The hp is nice. But mid game you don't need that hp yet. Well, you might, but just play safer/smarter at that point. Late game you need more hp. I do not like relying on life steal to try and give survival. its simply not enough will all the counters to it. Mallot is an option.
But, I'll probably recommend Banshees veil instead. Slightly cheaper. And a much better def vs many of those things that might be hitting you. such as yi-s alpha strike, teemos shrooms/blinding dart/eve's ravage, karsh's requim, ashes crystal arrow. The vast majority of tools people have to get close to you, and gank you, are magic in nature.


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Basilisk9466

Senior Member

01-07-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by MBirk View Post
Teemo's poison is passive on his autoattack.

Blinding dart is going to ruin your day in a head to head fight vs teemo. And chasing him into brush or off the main path into mushrooms will get you killed very quick as well.

Kiting him/using rocketjump to escape (early) is going to help alot.
He can't do an auto and a blinding at the same time - or he's never been able to do it to me. Might be a range thing? Not played much Teemo.


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Reivur

Senior Member

01-07-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Basilisk9466 View Post
He can't do an auto and a blinding at the same time - or he's never been able to do it to me. Might be a range thing? Not played much Teemo.
Typically they'll try to do Blind -> Auto Attack -> Retreat because other than your spells you can't retaliate due to being blinded. Its fairly adrupt since he can move fast too.


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Beegly Boogs

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Senior Member

01-07-2010

Only get the full frozen mallet if someone else on your team would benefit as much or more from lizard, IMO. Such as twitch.


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Lowman

Junior Member

01-07-2010

I can't say that i've ever had problems with late game trist unless I got shut out early/mid. I'd agree with earlier replies that getting that much non damage early is ruining your strengths. For another point of view, here's my build. Edit: Also, did I notice that you have two shoes? Waste of money since you only get the speed from one.

Runes: IAS, dodge, armor pen
Masteries: 21/0/9

Items
Vampiric Scepter (First and then upgrade to malady after boots)
Berserker's greaves
Last Whisper
Black Cleaver
Survivability item (Wardens or soul shroud or whatever you need against your enemy's team)
Frozen Mallet

Early and mid game are all about staying alive. I can mid against teemo or twitch and just exchange explosive shots. LS will allow me to stay in lane. but people know that trist is a squish sandwich so you have to always be prepared to jump away. Definitely get lizard whenever possible before mallet.

By late game your sitting at 2.0 AS without rapid fire and buku attack and you can auto down just about anybody while standing still.


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Neaan

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Junior Member

01-07-2010

After trying several builds with Trist, I think the Madred's Razors are ideal for her. The chance to one shot creep makes explosive even more epic. Also with a razor make sure you keep a ward on both lizards. After a Doran's Shield and a HP pot I tend to power to the 1.3k gold for razors and boots. Although after the next patch a Doran's Blade might be more effective than a shield.


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