High Elo Fiddles Build

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Ivandir

Senior Member

01-07-2010

To be honest the only trouble that I have with fiddlesticks is his HP. He is to squishy mid game because that is the time you are trying to increase your AP and MP. You can't really sacrifice your AP for health either because HP doesn't do anything for you mid game, end game it helps a lot.

Early game low HP fiddle help as it can bring some greedy twich, yi, eve, or whoever that you can easily terrify and drain while your lane buddy finishes them off.

Late game I would like to test a guardian angel I can pull it off in time. It's the best item when it comes to helping you complete your ult. I have seen fiddles with Guardian when they die mid ultimate and respawn back their ultimate comes back with them for 2-3 seconds left after their death. This is such a big booster to your killing spree since by the time you come back the enemies are probably at 20% hp and all your Q,W,E cooldowns are refreshed.


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Tempus Luder

Member

01-07-2010

I usually go:

Ruby Crystal (if we go liz/dragon/gank) or Sapphire Crystal + hp pots if we go lanes, then I build Catalyst.
After that it totally depends on the game:
If were winning, Sorc Shoes, Rod of Ages and Abyssal Scepter.
If were losing, Merc Threads, Banshees Veil and Frozen Heart.
If its back and forth I go Boots of Swiftness, Rod of Ages/Banshees Veil (depending on if they have alot of interrups) and then I can go either RoA or Scepter after. (Generally my games end at this point, very rarely goes beyond 30 min. I go max CD reduc + Magic Pen if it does).

Also if I go woods and our team gets dragon + 1-2+ team kills and I feel confident were stomping them I go Mejai's ASAP.

I use Magic Pen (red), HP/18 and armor (yellow), Magic Res (blue) and Armor/Magic Res (quints) runes.
Flash+Ghost (both improved).
9/0/17 masteries (not lvl 30 yet).

Generally I dont play to get all the kills but to deal as much damage as possible to their team and silencing them + fear in team fights.


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HowlingKommando

Senior Member

01-07-2010

Exhaust is definitely a solid choice for an offensive Fiddle.

Concerning Crow Storm, at least from my experiences is perhaps Fiddle's least important skill. Fiddle's primary strength is his double ranged disable with low cooldowns. With him around, you can often shut down guys like Mundo, Rammus, Alistar, Tryn who rely on split second spell timing. Drain has very respectable damage as well.

Crow Storm is ultimately used for ganks and when your team has a clear advantage during a team fight. Using it more than that usually just results in painting a target on yourself and dying in a blink of an eye, which is bad, considering how useful your disables are.


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Patyrn

Senior Member

01-07-2010

Quote:
Well, thats crazy talk imo. First, Fiddle can jungle which is a great way to farm gold. Second, dark wind is a great farming spell if you decide not to jungle.

The build you suggested looks fine but, if you're making item decisions based on a theoretical lack of gold I think you're doing it wrong.
He jungles fairly slowly, and even if he jungled fast it's less gold than just farming up entire creep waves.

Dark wind is actually pretty awful at farming creeps. Once you get it to a high rank it can be good for a group of low health creeps, or a small group of creeps so that each one eats enough bounces to die. Either way it's WAY worse than most caster's farming.

Go look at your creep kills after your fiddles games. I guarantee you're either worst or second worst almost every single time. Bad farming is a fact of life on fiddles.

Quote:
Fiddle's got such poor AP scaling that you only get 1/3 AP effectiveness for each of his abilities. He works so much better with Magic Pen, and you get a 1:1 benefit from reducing their resistances.
This is totally false. Every skill he has hits multiple times, and every one of them gets 2 to 1 or better. Not saying I don't like magic pen on him, but they do not scale badly with AP.

Drain 0.4 Ratio. 6 ticks = 2.4 AP ratio
Dark Wind 0.35 Ratio. 11 bounces = 3.85 AP ratio (with at least 2 targets)
Crowstorm 0.4 Ratio. 5 ticks = 2.0 AP ratio


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Poruku2

Senior Member

01-07-2010

I was about 1600+ last time I checked. That was a month ago, though. But, my build, which has never failed me, I posted.
http://leaguecraft.com/strategies/gu...er+Go+Negative!


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bobthegood

Senior Member

01-07-2010

I concur. Haunting + Sorc Shoes + Abyssal + Magic Pen runes + Magic Pen mastery is the way to go.


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Elementz

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The Council

01-08-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patyrn View Post
He jungles fairly slowly, and even if he jungled fast it's less gold than just farming up entire creep waves.

Dark wind is actually pretty awful at farming creeps. Once you get it to a high rank it can be good for a group of low health creeps, or a small group of creeps so that each one eats enough bounces to die. Either way it's WAY worse than most caster's farming.

Go look at your creep kills after your fiddles games. I guarantee you're either worst or second worst almost every single time. Bad farming is a fact of life on fiddles.

This is totally false. Every skill he has hits multiple times, and every one of them gets 2 to 1 or better. Not saying I don't like magic pen on him, but they do not scale badly with AP.

Drain 0.4 Ratio. 6 ticks = 2.4 AP ratio
Dark Wind 0.35 Ratio. 11 bounces = 3.85 AP ratio (with at least 2 targets)
Crowstorm 0.4 Ratio. 5 ticks = 2.0 AP ratio
Sorry to burst your bubble but you aren't that high of ELO and you don't know much about fiddle..

First of all. One of the best junglers in the game. He does a great job and farms beautifully at it. Master of LoL is the best fiddle in the game and he is a jungle fiddle.

2ndly. Dark wind is amazing at CSing early and late. Use it to last hit. You often get 1-2 more creep kills and or harras the other champ in the lane with it by casting it on low HP creeps leaving you open for easy last hitting with his auto attack.

My fiddle is usually the highest or 2nd highest in games when I play him for CS. I dunno how you play him but his farming abilities are just fine.

Also. Magic pen is A LOT stronger then pure AP on him. Since his abilties due scale poorly reguardless of them hitting multipul times pen is superior for him and getting pen runes, sorc boots, haunting guise, and an abyssal are all fantastic on him. Of course get a soulstealer, a RoA or a Banshee's (I prefer banshee's) but then hook up the spell pen. With just red runes taken up you can have 9, 16(fiddle passive), 20, 20 = 65 spell pen quite early in the game with just sorc boots and a haunting guise.

I usually go something like this.

Either i'll build for my guise getting the faerie charm and the other HP regen item (prereq's to making guise) and or start off with a ruby depending if we are going to team fight early or not.

I find having a 9/0/21 makes it so you have almost unlimited mana to spam dark wind and CS with it so dont worry about any real regen items other then a guise.

Then i'll go.

Guise
Catalyst
Sorc boots
Soulstealer

Make the cata into a banshee's or a RoA when you can then after that make an abysall scepter or a Rylais depending if you need some more HP if you're getting focused a lot.

Flash and ignite I use. Ignite is w/e just personal preference but flash is a MUST have.


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HowlingKommando

Senior Member

01-08-2010

I find Rylai >> RoA for Fiddle. Since for RoA, you're wasting money on more mana and Guise is sufficient from my experiences. Fiddle can also of course jungle Golem super easily.

One thing I was wondering is how Void Staff compares with Abyssal. They cost about the same, but Abyssal is almost half a defensive item because you're paying extra for a lot of MR. Whereas Void Staff the minor +250 mana doesn't factor as much into the cost.


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Balonar

Senior Member

01-08-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patyrn View Post
This is totally false. Every skill he has hits multiple times, and every one of them gets 2 to 1 or better. Not saying I don't like magic pen on him, but they do not scale badly with AP.

Drain 0.4 Ratio. 6 ticks = 2.4 AP ratio
Dark Wind 0.35 Ratio. 11 bounces = 3.85 AP ratio (with at least 2 targets)
Crowstorm 0.4 Ratio. 5 ticks = 2.0 AP ratio
So your opponents stand in your attacks and have zero MR? I don't think the topic is "Practice Game Fiddles Build".

In order to get a 1:1 effectiveness from AP you need to hit for at least 3 seconds/3 bounces AND mitigate all their MR. Whereas with MPen you get a near 1:1 effectiveness from your base damage, which turns out to be more damage than any AP you can stack.


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Patyrn

Senior Member

01-08-2010

Quote:
Sorry to burst your bubble but you aren't that high of ELO and you don't know much about fiddle..
There are only ~200 people between me and you on the top 500. That's pretty ****ed high ELO. I face you in a lot of my games.

Quote:
First of all. One of the best junglers in the game. He does a great job and farms beautifully at it. Master of LoL is the best fiddle in the game and he is a jungle fiddle.
He's a great jungler, I never said he wasn't. What he is not is a very fast jungler.

Quote:
2ndly. Dark wind is amazing at CSing early and late. Use it to last hit. You often get 1-2 more creep kills and or harras the other champ in the lane with it by casting it on low HP creeps leaving you open for easy last hitting with his auto attack.
Yes, I too use dark wind to last hit and harrass. The cooldown is pretty long though so it's not earning you that much money.

Quote:
My fiddle is usually the highest or 2nd highest in games when I play him for CS. I dunno how you play him but his farming abilities are just fine.
Then either you're having extremely boring games where you lane most of the time, or your team is equally bad at farming. The main reason he's bad at it is if a champ like singed is running to group up for a team fight, or to lay a ward, or whatever. All he has to do is run past a creep wave and he gets very single kill. Fiddle has to stop, cast dark wind, then sit there auto-attacking and draining to kill the wave. It takes him way longer, and you often cannot spare the time.

Quote:
Also. Magic pen is A LOT stronger then pure AP on him. Since his abilties due scale poorly reguardless of them hitting multipul times pen is superior for him and getting pen runes, sorc boots, haunting guise, and an abyssal are all fantastic on him. Of course get a soulstealer, a RoA or a Banshee's (I prefer banshee's) but then hook up the spell pen. With just red runes taken up you can have 9, 16(fiddle passive), 20, 20 = 65 spell pen quite early in the game with just sorc boots and a haunting guise.
I put the math up above... I guess if 2 to 1 or higher is poor scaling to you, you must hate all casters. Yes, magic pen is good on him, as it is on all casters. But it's no better for him than any other caster, and AP is definitely better for him than most casters. Don't get me wrong, I fully support getting magic pen, I'm simply arguing that his abilities do not scale poorly which is a fact. You should be aware of this elementz since I drain tanked you to death from HP to nothing through grog soaked blade a few games ago.