Need a bit of sion help

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Almagest

Senior Member

01-02-2010

Physical Sion is my favorite of the two builds, personally. It works with his ultimate much better.


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Akaleth

Junior Member

01-03-2010

For AP Sion, my item build goes like this.

Sapphire Crystal, 2 HP Pots
Upgrade that to Sheen
Get boots (choosing between Swiftness, Sorcs or Mercs depending on what I feel like/enemy comp)
Mejai's Soulstealer*
Upgrade Sheen to Lich Bane
Zhonya's Ring

Next two items are pretty much up to you. If the game is going very well for you, go for more AP items (because obviously 500 AP from the above items is not enough), otherwise go defensive. I like to get a Frozen Heart especially for the CD reduction and partly for the armor and mana. If the game gets past that, which it never has for me, then I'd probably go for an Archangel's Staff, Deathfire Grasp or a Warmog's for the extra HP.

A little bit about the Soulstealer: I find that a lot of times I end up against a team that knows how to not let me get kills. If you cannot get stacks, then it's a complete waste of gold. Most of the time, I either have 20 stacks or 3-4. If you go through a couple games and cannot seem to get the stacks, then you'd probably be better off getting an item like Deathfire Grasp before Lich Bane. This makes it so that you get Lich Bane and Zhonya's much later (with an extra 1400 gold to farm) but you're better off getting an item that will let you get more kills off than wasting 1235 gold on 20 AP. If you go this route, then I would get a Soulstealer after Lich Bane or Zhonya's.

For a skill build, this is what I usually go for the first 6 levels.
Stun if I'm in a 2-man lane, shield if I'm soloing
Enrage
Stun
Shield
Stun
Ult

After that I go completely crazy with my skill build. I've probably never done it the same way twice. However, I like to follow the trend of maxing my stun and then switching off with Enrage and shield. You may also consider holding off the last rank of your ultimate to max enrage and shield first.


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Gaeb

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Senior Member

01-03-2010

What I like about AP-directed Sion is his shield's burst power. It annihilates creep waves, scares the heck out of enemy creeps, etc. Max shield first = easy money = more hp from axe skill if you level that early.

That said, it's hard to sustain shield spam on physical Sion... Sion starts with near the lowest mana in game. BTW, Re: Sion's ult, his ult is *fantastic* for killing towers. Ergo my AP/DPS hybrid play lately.


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Almagest

Senior Member

01-03-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaeb View Post
What I like about AP-directed Sion is his shield's burst power. It annihilates creep waves, scares the heck out of enemy creeps, etc. Max shield first = easy money = more hp from axe skill if you level that early.

That said, it's hard to sustain shield spam on physical Sion... Sion starts with near the lowest mana in game. BTW, Re: Sion's ult, his ult is *fantastic* for killing towers. Ergo my AP/DPS hybrid play lately.

That's why you don't use shield spam on physical Sion. Up his attack speed, and you really won't have to -- He'll mow through creeps like Jason mows through campers in a Friday the 13th film.

Up his hitting power as well, and combined with his ultimate, not only will he be hitting hard, but he'll be healing himself and his allies nicely as well. Shield has a 4 second wait before you can blow it up. With physical Sion, you don't have to wait 4 seconds between swings; the damage potential in that amount of time on a champion, IMO, is higher in a physical build.

But that's personal preference; I tried AP Sion and it seemed too... Slow, to me.


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Gaeb

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Senior Member

01-03-2010

What's your item/skill build? I'm curious -- I felt physical Sion was too slow to start, which is why I gravitated toward AP sion where I could own creep waves from level 3 on...


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Akaleth

Junior Member

01-03-2010

Quote:
With physical Sion, you don't have to wait 4 seconds between swings; the damage potential in that amount of time on a champion, IMO, is higher in a physical build.
Yes, but that's assuming that you use nothing but your shield to do damage. You have to take into account the fact that he has his stun, ultimate and activation/detonation of shield, accounting for 4 hits with Lich Bane. Consider the fact that once you get to Zhonya's Ring in my build, you have about 500 AP. This means that your stun does 800 damage and the shield does 820. If you time everything correctly, then you have 4 Lich Bane hits, which are 600-700 damage each. This means that, in the span of 3-6 seconds, you have done 4k to 4.4k damage providing that you landed no non-Lich Bane'd melee hits. Chances are, especially with CD reduction, that you also will manage to land a second stun on the target. That means that you have done 4.8-5.2k damage before armor/MR in the span of up to 8 seconds, 820 of which has been done to every enemy around you.

That is why AP Sion is considerably stronger than AD Sion. I will admit, AP Sion starts out much slower than AD Sion, and can potentially become an ultimate failure, but if you know how to play AP correctly, the potential for ultimate destruction is much higher.


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Almagest

Senior Member

01-03-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaeb View Post
What's your item/skill build? I'm curious -- I felt physical Sion was too slow to start, which is why I gravitated toward AP sion where I could own creep waves from level 3 on...
Personally, I always go for Malady first. From there, Sheen helps, and I try to go for Frozen Mallet to make sure squishies can't run away. From there, Zeal/Phantom Dancer, Blood Thirster or Black Cleaver are all viable items. Make him hit harder and faster with his ultimate, and he's tough to take down by any means.

In a physical build, with Sion's ultimate, he becomes much harder to kill IMO -- Even when using his ultimate in his AP build I felt he couldn't keep up when a melee DPS got into his face. That could be, however, that I was playing him wrong which is something I always have to keep in mind.

Akaleth -- Reading your post, I'll definitely have to chalk it up to playing Sion wrong. When I did AP Sion, while I had the item setup right, my fights never went as smoothly as what you posted. I must not have been playing it correctly; I'll give it another few tries. Thanks!


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Gaeb

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Senior Member

01-03-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almagest View Post
Personally, I always go for Malady first. From there, Sheen helps, and I try to go for Frozen Mallet to make sure squishies can't run away. From there, Zeal/Phantom Dancer, Blood Thirster or Black Cleaver are all viable items. Make him hit harder and faster with his ultimate, and he's tough to take down by any means.

In a physical build, with Sion's ultimate, he becomes much harder to kill IMO -- Even when using his ultimate in his AP build I felt he couldn't keep up when a melee DPS got into his face.
Just a 411, I tend to build exe calling when I see a Sion ramping up like that... really does a number on his ult & malady lifesteal.


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Almagest

Senior Member

01-03-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaeb View Post
Just a 411, I tend to build exe calling when I see a Sion ramping up like that... really does a number on his ult & malady lifesteal.
I know Executioner's Calling works on heals; it also effects item and ability lifesteal?

Good to know; in that case, I better practice my AP Sion more.


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