Armor VS Dodge

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st1ye

Junior Member

12-22-2009

Hey Guys,

Just a few questions I have about Armor VS Dodge. Both Armor and Dodge only get applied to physical attacks right?

So Armor as explained by the sticky post on the forums is 1 armor = 1% more dmg needed to kill you.

wouldn't dodge work the same way? 1% dodge means they need 1% more attacks to kill you?

If thats true why would you spend 2K IP on a 1.5% Dodge quint when you can spend 1k IP on a 4.5 Armor quint?

any ways thats my question, please only thoughtful replies.


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Delicious Donut

Senior Member

12-22-2009

Your math is off. 1 point of armor adds another 1% of your base HP to EHP. Dodge divides your EHP by 1 - dodge chance. So they're not really comparable like that. If you have a lot of armor, getting dodge helps more than getting armor.


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NecroMage

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Senior Member

12-22-2009

Also, certain things trigger off of dodge such as nimbleness or Jax's counterattack, so those could also skew your preference slightly.


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JayceJa

Member

12-22-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiktok View Post
Your math is off. 1 point of armor adds another 1% of your base HP to EHP. Dodge divides your EHP by 1 - dodge chance. So they're not really comparable like that. If you have a lot of armor, getting dodge helps more than getting armor.
this

think of a rectangular prism, height is health, width is armor, depth is dodge, if all 3 added together give the same amount, then what combination of armor health and dodge give the most volume

answer, when they are all equal

therefore, 10 armor is less effective than 5 armor with 5 dodge

therefore, because armor is easier to get in game, dodge is inherently better for runes


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Delicious Donut

Senior Member

12-22-2009

If you have Excel you can use this spreadsheet to experiment with the effects of HP and armor on your overall durability. Enter the values of your champion's hp/armor/resist/dodge and the runes/items/masteries/whatever into the green field to see how much effective hp they add to see what benefits your champion the most.


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Vorador

The Council

12-22-2009

some things to consider outside of straight stats:

-armor helps vs towers, dodge does not.
-as said above, dodges can proc things like nimbleness.
-a dodged attack evades an attack proc as well (ie a dodged attack from someone with frozen mallet will not snare you, but a frozen mallet attack will snare you even if you have 500 armor. ps: i'm just assuming this.. i don't really pay that much attention at that level of detail, dont' see why it woudln't work this way though)
-dodge is very hard to get, armor is everywhere.
-dodge has some kind of soft cap.. dont' really know what it is though, somewhere in the 20-30% range?


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Melonyan

Senior Member

12-22-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vorador View Post
some things to consider outside of straight stats:

-armor helps vs towers, dodge does not.
-as said above, dodges can proc things like nimbleness.
-a dodged attack evades an attack proc as well (ie a dodged attack from someone with frozen mallet will not snare you, but a frozen mallet attack will snare you even if you have 500 armor. ps: i'm just assuming this.. i don't really pay that much attention at that level of detail, dont' see why it woudln't work this way though)
-dodge is very hard to get, armor is everywhere.
-dodge has some kind of soft cap.. dont' really know what it is though, somewhere in the 20-30% range?
Dodge can definately go WAY over that. Katarina gets like 80% from level 5 killer instincts/shunpo.


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Vorador

The Council

12-22-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Melonyan View Post
Dodge can definately go WAY over that. Katarina gets like 80% from level 5 killer instincts/shunpo.
yeah i don't relaly know how it works.. i just know big mac told me there was a softcap somewhere in the 20-30% range and i trust him cause he has a lot of dodge stacking experience since he uses jax


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Melonyan

Senior Member

12-22-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vorador View Post
yeah i don't relaly know how it works.. i just know big mac told me there was a softcap somewhere in the 20-30% range and i trust him cause he has a lot of dodge stacking experience since he uses jax
Hm that's weird then, maybe katarinas skill is some sort of exception to the rule. Can anyone confirm this? Also if this is true, does buying ninja tabi on kat not give you 91% after the shunpo? I always thought it did and that if I got dodge runes I'd have like, near physical immunity after. Thanks for ruining my dream if this cap is true, stupid cap.


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BrentClagg

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Recruiter

12-22-2009

Dodge works on diminishing returns. If you pick up a phantom dancer (30% dodge) you would have a 30% chance to dodge and a 70% chance to be hit. If you pick up another the 30% would come off of the 70% remaining chance to be hit. (70*.3 = 21% more reduction). This means that the 2nd phantom dancer was less effective. A third would be (49 * .3 = 14.7%). So adding this all together 30+21+14.7 = 65.7% chance to dodge as opposed to the 90% expected through simple addition.

Katarina's would play in the same way, just giving her bigger start on reducing it. Hope this helps.


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