The most idiotic items made so far are:

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Lupa

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Recruiter

12-20-2009

Solution: Make counters to counter counters! Hai, I did just bought my sniper rifle item to shoot dem execustioners cawling outta yer inventry.


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Semei

Senior Member

12-20-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schlateman View Post
Here i have an idea the Semei... Lets take out stealth, stuns, slows, and any other kind of disabling skill. Then all we have left are nukes. Then we will just 5v5 and see who wins by who can blow their load first.
Sound like a good idea? If not, then SHUT THE **** UP!
Stuns, Slows <-> cleanse, mercury threads, hp, armor, magic resist, stuns, slows

You did not know this stun, slow balance that exists in game or you are just playing dumb??

Stealth , yes, remove stealth - leaving only shaco and eve, who has nice strategic stealth with short duration.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lupa View Post
Solution: Make counters to counter counters! Hai, I did just bought my sniper rifle item to shoot dem execustioners cawling outta yer inventry.
You actually got this - there should be counters to counter counters As for ability power <-> magic resist, the balance is maintained and things go bad where is no counter to counter counter as executioners calling or in different occasions there is counter to counter counter, but that counter is not a viable option because its a lot more cheaper to get one counter than the other - as for example - cleanse (prew patch) vs disables.


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Schlateman

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Member

12-20-2009

I love how you call everyone stupid and dumb, yet no one in the thread has sided with your opinion. Are you one of those twitches that go 3-10-4? and qq because you are supposed to be op and feared, yet so easily killable? Or is it eve that you play because you are willing to remove stealth except for hers and shaco's?

Seriously man just learn how to play...
I remember when i played dota religiously and one of my friends would get a stealthed unit from -ar and the other team would by a gem and the gem would almost immidiately been dropped and destroyed. You need to stop living in this world than one item is game breaking... some has the elixir pot on them ff him done no more sight. someone got wards? get wards and destroy theirs... now they have wasted g and you have a leg up with the sight from ward.
Seriously stop QQ'ing and L2P


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Semei

Senior Member

12-20-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schlateman View Post
I love how you call everyone stupid and dumb, yet no one in the thread has sided with your opinion. Are you one of those twitches that go 3-10-4? and qq because you are supposed to be op and feared, yet so easily killable? Or is it eve that you play because you are willing to remove stealth except for hers and shaco's?

Seriously man just learn how to play...
I remember when i played dota religiously and one of my friends would get a stealthed unit from -ar and the other team would by a gem and the gem would almost immidiately been dropped and destroyed. You need to stop living in this world than one item is game breaking... some has the elixir pot on them ff him done no more sight. someone got wards? get wards and destroy theirs... now they have wasted g and you have a leg up with the sight from ward.
Seriously stop QQ'ing and L2P
As for now the one QQ'ing is you, im posting serious balance issues that have nothing to do with whatever you are talking about.


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Swiftstar88

Senior Member

12-20-2009

Really? Go play against a competent Twitch and the start complaining that Twitch is OP because he rolled over you when you didn't buy any elixirs or wards. Or maybe you're QQing because you're a Twitch player who keeps getting owned by people who buy items like this. Considering you're complaining about items that allow people to see assassins (like twitch) and help negate lifesteal (very useful on twitch), I find that second option highly likely. And if that's the case, grow up and LTP.

EDIT: Awe, beaten to the punch, not cool... ;_;


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Arkas Harrok

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Junior Member

12-21-2009

Why does there have to be an item to counter an item? How about just adjusting your play style and tactics to make up for items like "executioner's calling"?

The item doesn't make them useless it just stops them from being so aggressive and makes you have to rely on other options outside of healing all the time.

If you're relying on health regeneration and healing to give you an edge and some gets an item meant to reduce your healing then you try and work around that. You also have to take into account that not everyone builds up items for a reason. Executioner's Calling is cheap because it isn't that strong of an item anyways since it's only 18% critical chance and 15% life-steal.

As far as the other items it doesn't really matter because even with armor penetration your giving up potential damage to have it. Same with Executioner's Calling.. you only get some critical chance and life-steal with a tiny dot and a healing cripple for 12 seconds.. that's it. It only hurts if your only tactic is relying on heals and regeneration.. and even then you can just out-smart the block head.

As I see it.. your items are only useful as a whole in combination with your hero's abilities even though some builds are easy enough to transfer from one hero to the next. If your items have don't aid your champion then you've wasted gold, but if your items give you an edge in a fight then you've managed to counter a champion and someone's style.

I say.. the items and champion are only as good as the player. Meaning.. if you can't counter something with what you have.. then you may want to rethink things.


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Semei

Senior Member

12-21-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkas Harrok View Post
Why does there have to be an item to counter an item? How about just adjusting your play style and tactics to make up for items like "executioner's calling"?
Lets play Sion and ignore hes ult, thats the tactic? You are SERIOUS or drunk?

And as for me, i dont even want you to understand the big picture with those items, its not you who decides what is good and what is not. Im just keeping discussion alive around things i think need attention. The issue is stated in my posts and answers to other posters. As long as discussion is there it will recieve a look from game design staff and more investigation if needed, you are naive that you can just make them stop investigating things just because you say something or just want your favorite op stuff to stay alive forever.

Im not the only poster about Stealth -wards, oracle- (twiches, evelyns, shacos), executioners calling or divine sword.

And you have no power or whatsoever to dismiss my findings in real game experience just because you dont like discussion or dont like me.


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Whitemage82

Senior Member

12-21-2009

I kinda agree with the OP (though not his whining tactics or rage.) These items make these champions a lot less fun to play.

My strategy is don't play champions with such obvious downsides, they aren't worth playing. You endanger your chances of winning your match. Play heroes who's abilities cannot be countered directly by items like Executioner's Calling.


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Mikhur

Member

12-21-2009

So Yi got an executioner's calling. Oh noes. Switch lane. He just wasted that money on an item, and if you're sneaky sneaky, you can even get a gank on some other lane. Not bad.

Yeah, counters suck. Trust me, I play Jax every now and then, and seeing that **** sword makes me want to cry, but it doesn't mean YOU can't change your strategy. You don't HAVE to bash your head against a wall, trying to play the same way with his counter.

The "OP" items are those that can counter an entire team, with only one item. I don't think you'll have 5 healers, or 5 dodgers, etc. If he's gonna adjust to you, then adjust to him.

That said, it can suck, but not the ridiculously egregious way that you say it so.

Also, you're playing Mundo... 'nuff said.


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EchoRex

Senior Member

12-21-2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Semei View Post
You actually got this - there should be counters to counter counters
They already exist, but you apparently don't know them. Guess the skill component you want as a counter eludes you as much as posting a response that addresses what is actually said.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Semei View Post
This is my argument - you are talking about countering one STACKING with ANOTHER and it has NOTHING to do with DISABLING or WEAKENING certain champion skills. Eg healing and stealth.
Armor and Attack Speed reduction procs reduces physical damage, weakening physical damage buffing abilities.

Magic Resistance reduces ability damage, aka weakening the abilities versus that target.

Also, I didn't state stacking to counter one thing. I said that those item types and item passives counter those types of abilities, damage sources, and stacking. Please keep up with the actual argument instead of making stuff up to fit your own idea.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Semei View Post
If im mundo just a lvl 6 mundo with basic items, say philos and whatsoever boots, and someone gets executioners calling as a cheap starting item, or im soraka with chalice, boots and catalyst and someone gets that calling and HOW IS THAT BALLANCED if someone can get cheap item to just counter my abilities AND do more damage plus heal by himself.
Mundo isn't only regen. And the item cost comparison is fine, you should be able to run that person down and cleaver/masochism/burning agony them to death, it doesn't stop the regen completely. This works, I do it all the time, just can't play scared because a counter exists. Mundo is as close to unkillable as anything in this game gets if someone doesn't bring an Executioners.

Soraka's perma push ability is countered, smart move by the opponent. Now they can heal for about the same as you do with their life steal. Incoming lane mate to crush them because you have survivability items and they spent their money on a counter immediately. This situation is countered by them countering themselves with resource allocation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Semei View Post
THIS IS ARGUMENT. Try to find logic in this and try to get what im saying, ask some adult if you cant to help you:

armor pen <-> armor,
magic pen <-> magic resist,
armor <-> physical damage,
magic resist <-> ability power

This is right? One counters other. <---BALANCE (note that even this can be imbalanced if for example getting damage costs more than getting armor to counter it, etc)
Yes. What I said, maybe you can try not to quote other people at themselves to fulfill a poorly conceived position.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Semei View Post
Next, the same thing, that you dont get:

executioners calling -> mundo, soraka, etc - heals in general (see the one sided arrow - executioners calling counters them, but they cant counter executioners calling)

executioners calling <- ???
Cost if early game, Exhaust, Stun, Blind, Fear, Dodge, Snare and Kite, then Cleanse or Quicksilver Sash.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Semei View Post
No way to counter! Whaa, what a surprise! You can counter one way, but cant in other! Nice huh? GET IT?
I get that you're wrong and apparently can't think of how to use items, abilities or summoner spells.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Semei View Post
In real situation there IS counter (sad one):

executioners calling <-> Not getting healing champion, not playing mundo or healing support

GG
Yawn. Still wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Semei View Post
If thats not obvios here is how it SHOULD look like:

executioners calling <-> stacking lifesteal

and NOT champion abilities
Thats asinine. What counter would there be to those items, abilities and summoner spells then?

Exactly, the result would be what you are crying about now incorrectly, no counter.

At the least this time you almost responded to what was said, even if you do go out of your way to ignore counters involving thought, abilities, and skill to whine about whatever pops in your head.


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