Skarner, I miss your kind

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encyclopedea

Senior Member

12-02-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by GypsyReborn View Post
no no what happened was my suppression went off. he was in the ultimate and everything when his jump went off. im 100% sure that shouldn't be happening but i know for a fact i experienced it l0l.

it used to be where if he jumped first and then you ulted he would be captured anyway and be flung back into melee range. so it was the other way around from what i was describing here.
Still a glitch lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GypsyReborn View Post
i am definitely in favor of the 3rd option here. the reason why skarner is a fun champion on live right now is primarily BECAUSE you can stick to people. because you CAN stick to champions like glue in which no other champion actually can without building some items that allows them to (i.e. gauntlet + frozen mallet).
I agree here. Even though it is a straight up nerf, it retains one of the more fun aspects of Skarner, while preventing it from being too frustrating to play against. This in turn would allow more power to be added to Skarner's kit. Also, the thing about being less spammy with the Q's would not really be true- there is still more damage output to spamming, especially if you did it this way: keep the charging mechanic, so the second hit of Q applies the slow. Then, only apply the mark when that slow is applied. With that, Skarner can get that ever so fun slow off for a bit, then if the other champion doesn't take the chance to get the heck out of there while the marks are wearing off, he can punish them again. Overall, this would be a great change, provided that there were some buffs to go along with it. By allowing Skarner to keep a fun aspect of his kit, while limiting it so as not to be overpowered, and allowing more power to be added into Skarner's kit because of this, Skarner would become much better. Heck, if you wanted to get fancy, you could even make his E consume the marks for a heal, and if there are no marks on the enemy champion, it would slow them.

So a quick run-down on what I think would be some great changes (read this if you didn't read the above, or if you didn't understand it):

Crystalline Slash (Q)- Charges when it hits something. If charged, Crystalline Slash slows enemies (or just enemy champions?) and adds a stacking mark to them for a medium-short duration. After a certain number of marks is reached, Crystalline Slash can no longer slow the enemy.

Fracture (E)- A line skillshot. If it hits an enemy marked with 1 or more Crystalline Slash marks, it consumes the marks to heal Skarner. If it hits an enemy champion not marked with at least 1 Crystalline Slash marks, it slows that champion.

Credit to KyIinh for the Q idea.

This would add a lot of interplay to Skarner's kit, and allow enemies to have a chance to escape by dodging the E (for those of you who don't take physics, if they circle Skarner, depending on the radius of the E, chances are they will not be hit), while bringing back the heal, which although looked down upon by many, I have found to be an extremely useful ability.

Edit 1: With a few other buffs to compensate this change in power, of course. Possibly ramp up his W?

Edit 2: Added the slow-if-not-marked idea to the E. After all, part of our frustration is being able to engage. Also, its a great trade-off idea, and we all know Riot loves its trade-off ideas. Either slow from range, or get a longer duration on your melee slows. Also, the situationality of the heal would allow Riot to increase the amount healed. Before, you could E->Q for the heal. Now, you have to Q->Q->E to get a heal.


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Karede

Senior Member

12-02-2013

The idea would still severely hamper his ability to chase down tanks, which is one of the few unique things Skarner provides, but it's better than what they have on the table now. He would need his E to do burst damage to compensate for the nerf, at least. I still don't see why he can't keep a permaslow on Q. There are an unbelievable amount of skills that champions have to get away from Skarner. 50+

I would love to get the movement speed out of W for a duration, instead of however long the shield is on for. It's too easy to pop, and if we need to level E for anything, the only thing it's good for is initiation speed, and that's it.


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Shahamut

Senior Member

12-03-2013

I honestly think his w needs a passive armor/magic resist bonus. Then you could leave the shield as is. Thou a slight bump on the speed would be ok by me.

Also, if they are going to insist on moving the slow to his e, then they either need to add two secs to the duration or they need to leave the mark on there and have consuming the mark reapply the slow.

*EDIT* This would be pretty cool in my opinion. Then at least once I hit you with my ranged slow, if I can get up to you and hit you once, you'll at least have to stick around for a little bit. I don't want to play one hit chases.

Slow Enemy
Run them down
Hit them once as they run
wait for cooldown
wash, rinse, repeat. :\


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GypsyReborn

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Senior Member

12-03-2013

im pretty sure im not the only one whos asked this already. BUT....with the re-release of skarners new kit will he be getting a new skin? (i do think rock candy skarner can be a thing)


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WilbusDumbledore

Junior Member

12-03-2013

I'm a fan of a new Skarner skin...Rock Candy i like,Eternum Skarner, and Battlecast Skarner seem like obvious choices too.


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WilbusDumbledore

Junior Member

12-03-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karede View Post
The idea would still severely hamper his ability to chase down tanks, which is one of the few unique things Skarner provides, but it's better than what they have on the table now. He would need his E to do burst damage to compensate for the nerf, at least. I still don't see why he can't keep a permaslow on Q. There are an unbelievable amount of skills that champions have to get away from Skarner. 50+

I would love to get the movement speed out of W for a duration, instead of however long the shield is on for. It's too easy to pop, and if we need to level E for anything, the only thing it's good for is initiation speed, and that's it.
I'm not sure I get how the mark is supposed to work with the slow on E, Unless they increase the amount of time the mark stays on the target. Part of the point of the mark is you need the CDR from auto attacks in order to get the second E off before the mark disappears. If you use the E to help gap close, chances are you aren't going to be able to get off auto attacks to reduce the Cooldown to get your second E before the mark is gone.

Either increase the mark duration or remove it and replace with a slowing poison/dot. Skarner is scorpion after all.


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Shahamut

Senior Member

12-03-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
This is crazy how much good feedback you guys have lol. I can barely keep up with the thread. I'm seeing a few things popping up in almost every post.

-Skarner's ult is AWESOME (jawesome?) and it is his defining ability
-Skarner is very mana dependent and without blue he suffers
-Skarner is very easily kited
-Getting permaslowed by Skarner is frustrating
-Skarner's E ability (Fracture) doesn't feel useful/can be somewhat clunky to use
-Other junglers (zac/j4/voli etc) are more reliable in ganking and teamfights

Am I missing anything?
This was posted on page 16. The bold comment above is what I want to focus on:

When I reread all the previous posts (prior to the one I quoted) I was astonished to find thus:

Perma-slow unfun to play against: 14

Of those 14 posts that listed perma-slow as unfun to play against, 2 or 3 of them conceded that it was fine though, because its skarner, or cuz he can be easily kited.

FAAAAAR more often, his Ultimate is listed as the most unfun aspect of playing against Skarner.

Perma-Slow on his Q is praised in several other posts as one of the most FUN aspects of playing AS Skarner.

This is not as thorough of a survey as it could have been, as I only counted the negative votes, and as I counted things like "not getting away" and "him catching you" as votes against his perma-slow. My question is: Why now is perma-slow the target?


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GypsyReborn

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Senior Member

12-03-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shahamut View Post
This was posted on page 16. The bold comment above is what I want to focus on:

When I reread all the previous posts (prior to the one I quoted) I was astonished to find thus:

Perma-slow unfun to play against: 14

Of those 14 posts that listed perma-slow as unfun to play against, 2 or 3 of them conceded that it was fine though, because its skarner, or cuz he can be easily kited.

FAAAAAR more often, his Ultimate is listed as the most unfun aspect of playing against Skarner.

Perma-Slow on his Q is praised in several other posts as one of the most FUN aspects of playing AS Skarner.

This is not as thorough of a survey as it could have been, as I only counted the negative votes, and as I counted things like "not getting away" and "him catching you" as votes against his perma-slow. My question is: Why now is perma-slow the target?
because they (the people at riot games) have found that the reason why skarner isn't fun is because out of the champions that have a perma slow (anivia ashe sejuani skarner) skarner's is the most consistently hardest to get away from because his slow is on a 3.5 second cd and is reappliable.

Skarners Q slow : rank 1: 20% duration 2s cd 3.5 seconds

Sejuani E slow: rank 1: 50% Duration 2.5s cd 11 seconds

Ashe Q slow: rank 1: 15% duration 2s cd 0 seconds(needs to be within auto attack range)

anivia Chilled passive slow: flat 20% duration 3s CD 12 seconds (for the sake of testing the chilled passive off her Q lvl 1 will be used as the cd)

this is comparing all the champions ( who i currently remember if i missed one i can add it) who have a permaslow like effect in their kits and for all intents and purposes of this post all skills are lvl 1 statistics. i think skarners slow is a bit over the top.

edit: also more food for thought. its a 2s slow on a 3.5 cd but take into account the auto attacks that reduce this by .5 seconds and on champions 1 second.


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Karede

Senior Member

12-03-2013

SO, since being stunned so long by leona is annoying, shouldn't that mean they are going to take away all her stuns? Since being 3 shot by leblanc is annoying, shouldn't they nerf her into oblivion?

EVERY champ in league of legends has something annoying about them to fight against.... THAT"S WHY PEOPLE PICK THEM...

There is absolutely no reason whatsoever that they need to remove permaslow on Skarner. He is FARRR from the most annoying/amazing champ in the game.


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Majin Bl3u

Senior Member

12-03-2013

Why are you guys still posting in this thread? Scruffy made it blatantly obvious that he has no interest in our feedback on the new skarner kit. He made it obvious when he constantly denied our ideas for reworks on his abilities and went with his own subpar idea to move the slow and give him a clunky AS stacking steroid.

Even though a clear majority of us agree that the direction they went with this rework is wrong, Scruffy plugs his ears and continues on. They don't care how we want to play the champ. They don't care if we approve of the changes. They don't care if we ever play skarner again. Scruffy's job was to remake skarner and honeslty I doubt he has the resolve to really do a good job at it.

Should I be criticizing Scruffy so harshly? Probably not. But I'm not one to bite my tongue in this type of situation. I'm sorry but this rework is going the way of trundle/olaf/karma. There will be a blip of increased play as players test out the new kit and rioters cheer "Hoorah! We've done it! The rework was a success". Then when a month or 2 pass they will be tossed to the curb and forgotten again.

Whats the point in doing anything half-assed? I just don't think Scruffy has the resolve.