Skarner, I miss your kind

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TogarIrongrinder

Junior Member

08-16-2013

Most fun aspects of skarner: He looks cool, animations look cool, R is really fun when you land it.

Most Frustrating: With tank items making tanks not nearly what they used to be, combined with blade sapping his sheild and stopping his forward charge making it extremely difficult for him to reach an important carry with his ultimate before he gets blown up, and mercurial scimitar being a get out of jail free card with extreme synergy with an ad carry kit, the fact that you can also flash it mid cast, and burn his cd makes his ultimate a really inconsistent, and unrewarding. It was a good fix last year, but there is already too many things working against his kit in the meta for it to be so easily countered by flash when it is already countered by smart itemization. (excessively detailed version on this thread i posted forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3774279&highlight=skarner)

Any champions that do his job better?
Xin, zac, noct, maokai, amumu literally any viable tanky jungler with a gap closer.

Sorry thought you said "most frustrating aspect of playing skarner" not "playing against skarner"

Most frustrating aspect of playing against him is his early game red buff gank, and his pretty manly jungler dueling ability, he's hard to fight with double buffs, even if you have them yourself, but I think it's pretty balanced.


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Cujomi

Senior Member

08-16-2013

First I'd like to say thanks for taking so much time to really tweak Skarner and try to improve his QoL (even though I think he's fine the way he is, I know that a lot of people don't agree).

• What are the most fun aspects of playing Skarner?

Definitely his flash ult, and then the way that he can stick to people once they've been caught out of position. Nothing is more fun than being able to make people pay big time for making mistakes. I think this is a big part of the reason that the QoL on R needed to be addressed because I have found in many matches where a crucial R hasn't gone off and it makes what could have been a perfect move fall flat.

• What are the most frustrating/unfun aspects of playing Skarner?

See above -- not having R go off when you are pretty sure that you had them in range for a perfect opportunity can be very frustrating. Also only having access to 3 skills until forced to level E can be somewhat annoying, but the other skills work really well with him as a jungler so it's not a huge deal to me.

• Are there champions that do Skarner’s job better than he does? Why?

I wouldn't say so really. He has a pretty unique ultimate that allows him to really punish positional mistakes. Obviously other champions can do that, but not quite in the same way. Overall I think there are some stronger junglers right now, but I don't attribute that so much to Skarner needing to change as much as I feel that they are just a bit too strong right now (Zac specifically).


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Protonhunter

Senior Member

08-16-2013

Been asking for a while but you haven't been here for a bit scruff so I'll just repost it.

Is there any time frame for the release of the new improved skarner? Could we get a really loose one, like before the end of the year or even first quarter of next year?


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nickeput

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Member

08-16-2013

I have only recently come back to playing league after awhile off but I remember when Skarner was broken from release and he got a small buff that wasn't supposed to be the only buff because they wanted to not go overboard and make him op. The main change to him was the reduced and flat mana cost to his q being I think it was 15 for all levels. This made people start playing Skarner a lot more and people didn't want to learn how to counter his ult, say buying a qss or picking gangplank when you see him picked in ranked, but instead cried he was op. His ult ended up being reduced by .25 seconds in duration and the issue with his mana costs on q that had been acknowledged by riot staff was reverted with the final rank being only 2 mana less per cast than his original release q.

The only thing I would want in order to fix Skarner as someone who played him before he got his original fix was that his q be reverted to the lower cost maybe not 15 since apparently that made him op to all squishies but at least 18-20 at all ranks. Also have his e fire while moving instead of stopping him in place; I have never thought his w broke easily or his e didn't hit hard/heal a noticeable amount. This was because the way I found that was best suited to build Skarner was to capitalize on ability power, attack speed, cool down reduction, and movement speed. And I only jungled Skarner unless I was needed to go top lane.

I don't want to see his kit reworked because the way it is works perfectly his q can proc the marks from e on jungle camps, champions, or minion waves for massive heals with ap. Also when you build for ap and have a lich bane not a tri force like everyone assumed was core on Skarner you had a big shield that almost never broke, your q would proc lich bane on towers to melt them, your e would hit for easily 500+, and you could melt anyone and everything. The best part of the AP/AS Skarner was that you couldn't be built against, what I mean by that is in games that hit 40+ mins you will have over 500k damage from your q spam alone clearing entire minions waves in one e or one q's(just because of them being spread out) and just over half your damage would be magic with the rest being physical so no matter which they built to stop you still were dealing big numbers.

TLDR: I love Skarner how his kit is with my only complaint I would honestly need to be fixed is his mana on q specifically and make his e cast while moving. His ult being easily cancelled is another concern but if just his q and e got fixed I would be happy. A rework of his kit isn't needed just mana and cast time adjustments. Without his perma slow on q, w the way it is is perfect, aoe heal and nuke on e, and repositioning of enemy with r Skarner just wouldn't be Skarner anymore and I would probably stop playing him because he is the most fun champ to play. Nothing beats the ability to run past all 3 turrets in lane chasing someone down to kill them next to their nexus because your shield tanked the turret hits.


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skittlzlol

Member

08-16-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Protonhunter View Post
Been asking for a while but you haven't been here for a bit scruff so I'll just repost it.

Is there any time frame for the release of the new improved skarner? Could we get a really loose one, like before the end of the year or even first quarter of next year?
When the team, including Scruffy, feels it's complete. Really the could one day decide the entire approach is wrong and scrap it and start fresh, so it's too dynamic to specify anything. Contrary to what many people believe with these reworks (karma, sejuani and yi) I actually believe they do a fantastic job and understand how the improvements ought to go.


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metafoxx

Senior Member

08-16-2013

I'm not sure I like skarner needing all his slow to come from a skinny skill shot. It weakens his trademark aoe cc that players like him for (a circle is more effective than a line). I understand the thought process, but I think that something better could be come up with for this. Not to mention, it's rather uncreative. It's just "a line nuke that slows". I think we can do better.

Maybe something like (just pulling this off the top of my head):

Fracture keeps its new range, but does much less damage and marks targets. The first target damaged by skarner will make the mark explode, doing aoe damage and slowing all enemies hit (kind of like a triggered current skarner Q).

OR, since a blink-style change to his W was suggested:

W is no longer a shield, activating it makes skarner burrow underground for a few seconds, giving him move speed, % damage reduction and cannot be autoattacked or hit by single-target abilties while underground (aoes still work). He can still use Q, E and R while underground but cannot autoattack. Using R will automatically reveal him and end W.

I doubt riot is willing to make a change that big to skarner, they seem to just want to rearrange his stuff rather than giving him totally new stuff, and a change like that would significantly alter his playstyle and possibly make him OP, but if we're just throwing out drastic changes to his abilities then something like that would have more flavor. Remember I'm just throwing that one out there, though. The E changes are the ones we should really be talking about.


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Diccups

Junior Member

08-16-2013

• What are the most fun aspects of playing Skarner?

Ulting the right carry and eliminating them, then having an awesome chase.

• What are the most frustrating/unfun aspects of playing Skarner?

His ult is GLITCHY. kiting and gap closing aside, if i could just flash (or change his E to be a tunnel move where the enemy cant tell where he will appear), actually closing the gap and ulting but it glitching up is awful feeling.


IMO, he needs a gap closer. Almost like ZAC's E. Make it a tunneling move and have cho'gath Q style circle appear where he will tunnel out and give the enemy ample time to dodge it, make it a denial tool like "oh **** hes behind us and close to our carry!"


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skittlzlol

Member

08-16-2013

A burrow is not what skarner needs, just consistent disruption. Skarner is one of those champions that become more dangerous the longer skirmishes or fights last. He's not an assassin so an untargettable dash doesn't fit him.


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RiotScruffy

Game Designer

08-16-2013
21 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Protonhunter View Post
Been asking for a while but you haven't been here for a bit scruff so I'll just repost it.

Is there any time frame for the release of the new improved skarner? Could we get a really loose one, like before the end of the year or even first quarter of next year?
Don't have many specifics about when the rework will go out to live. It will most likely not be before world finals so that Skarner doesn't disrupt the competitive scene.


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nickeput

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Member

08-16-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotScruffy View Post
Don't have many specifics about when the rework will go out to live. It will most likely not be before world finals so that Skarner doesn't disrupt the competitive scene.
Don't changes like this not affect the competitive games because they play on a slightly older version of the game to prevent changes from doing just that?