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Tanky DPS metagame...

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Carnack

Senior Member

11-30-2010

Quote:
Arckhitecture:
Do you actually think it's THAT easy to kill tanks, when carries are meant to kill the other carries THEN the tanks?

Yes, I've tried that build, but my hero wouldn't survive more than 5 seconds during a teamfight because of focus-firing methods.


And you're in their sights why?

Tanks go in first to louse them up and take the brunt of the damage and kill off the softer targets and prime damage dealers.

Then the ranged carry comes in and mops up.

At no point should they be able to get within range to focus you.


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zhenn

Senior Member

11-30-2010

Quote:
Phreak:
I think the unfortunate thing here is that people keep thinking Madred's is the anti-tank item.

Beating tanks means go Last Whisper with heavy physical items like Infinity Edge. Also the biggest thing about beating tanks is actually last hitting as a carry. You must get ahead of their level curve with your item pacing. The simple fact is that tanky champions scale with level while DPS champions scale with items. Because it's fairly difficult to prevent players from leveling, it's on the individual skill of the player to maximize their own gold income.


tanky champions scale really well with items too, actually.

because there is no diminishing return for stacking armor/mr.


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ironpot

Senior Member

12-10-2010

Quote:
Rakeash:
What is the Madred's Bloodrazer in the game for?


killing baron?


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Pyronymer

Senior Member

12-10-2010

Didn't Riot themselves originally tell us the intention of Madred's and it's % damage was directly and explicitly for dealing with HP/Defense stacking tanks, you know, like, when they introduced it.

Now they are saying "oops no, lol, buy other things, Madred's is terrible for that". Well gee, sounds like a failed item design to me.

Especially since it actually harms squishy targets much more and is commonly bought by certain tanky champs and builds explicitly to boost their damage, what with the item in practice being better FOR a tanky champion than as a counter TO a tanky champion.


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PoDragonSlayer

Senior Member

12-10-2010

I support this thread.


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Misere Do Queijo

Senior Member

12-10-2010

xin, olaf and garen

walking around with their BV's, SunFires, Mallets, Randuins and Guardian Angels
haters gonna hate


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JuanBarco

Recruiter

12-10-2010

LOL at Tanky meta, I agree with Phreak on the LW and IE being anti tank Items if they try to stack Armor. But as WW I love getting MBR and Magic Pen Boots and literally raping their tanks with Auto attacks and Hungering strike. Destroy them unless they stack MR, which enable our carry. But alot of tanks that stack aror it does destroy them. I love seeing MAge tanks with alot of healt but no MR. To me most tanks mean steal their health to survive a team fight and hunt down all the rest. Honestly if you hit lvl 18 and tanks are still rolling you, then something is wrong. They have a strong early game and probably will out lvl you. but eventually they are useless.


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AtIanta

Senior Member

12-10-2010

all melee characters are largely dependant on farm just to deal damage without dying. Melees often do not farm as well as ranged. This is why ranged are getting nerfed, so that their superior farming capabilities do not put them too far ahead of the curve.


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cowsaysmuuu

Junior Member

12-10-2010

Quote:
Phreak:
I think the unfortunate thing here is that people keep thinking Madred's is the anti-tank item.

Beating tanks means go Last Whisper with heavy physical items like Infinity Edge. Also the biggest thing about beating tanks is actually last hitting as a carry. You must get ahead of their level curve with your item pacing. The simple fact is that tanky champions scale with level while DPS champions scale with items. Because it's fairly difficult to prevent players from leveling, it's on the individual skill of the player to maximize their own gold income.


This is all nice and sounds cool, but as you said they gain advantage while they level, while a carry scales with items.

How much a Last Whisper and Infinity Edge cost? Lot's of money.

Boots, wards, (oracle if needed). You farm farm farm farm and farm... by the the time you got this items you are:

1. dead because you got towerdived like hell

2. you can't farm simply because you can't kill em and they dominate the jungle

Basicly you lost the game. As far as I could see from pro players usually get an IE by 18-20 mins into game, based on their luck (got kills or not).

20 mins into the game you already lost most of the time.

They gain level faster then you gain gold. I'm not a pro, but I know how to last hit. I always last hit minions if I can, but that ain't gonna give you ****, when two god **** tanks just charges at you at your OWN tower and ain't give a **** about it.

Furthermore gaining levels is much easier compared to gaining gold. Even If I last hit well (which usually happens, except when I try out new heroes and going first time with em) my teammates under certain circumstances can't do very well.

For example, I laned with my friend last night as a Karth (tried him) and he as a Poppy (okay, not the best lane combination I know, we just had fun and Poppy is the worst farmer in the game) and a Mordekaiser raped us like no tomorrow with simple defensive items. He solo-laned. He didn't last hit at all, or basicly he didn't care about it. (I got more last with Karth then he did). He came back with two basic regen items+boot+negatron cloak at lvl 7 (nearly lvl 8) towerdived and killed our poppy from full health. Just like that.

Tower killing me? Pffft. Ignore it. Where's the skill at that? Nowhere. Btw that mrode was lvl 15 while our poppy was lvl 19. Was it fair? No. Even both of us+tower coudnt kill the ****er.


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TheL4ughingM4n

Senior Member

12-10-2010

Played a game last night where we had the other team pushed back to the base, but then it hit the magic point where they all got sunfires even though we kept them from mostly farming.

Their team was amumu, chogath, malphite, nasus, veigar. (Even veigar went sunfires).

The sheer amount of CC, and stuns they had ended up tipping team fights to their side. At the end of the game, though the kill count was roughly the same, they ended up winning.

Their team had 17 sunfires in total, and we even tried to counteract it with MR. It didn't matter. Even with a karthus on our team with 700 AP, we couldn't dent them due to their health pools.

Even with 75% max reduction, with 17 sunfires, it is 170 magic damage AOE per second.

Talk about an anti-fun game though. Amumu ult to malphite ult to chogath knockup to veigar root to dead without being able to do anything.